[alt-media-res] more paranioa that needs answering !!
devlishmay at aktivix.org
devlishmay at aktivix.org
Wed Jan 3 00:48:58 GMT 2007
Wondered how people wanted to respond to this
Penniex
Hi,
We've just been discussing a funded research project on irc that includes some
imcistas as well as academics. The project focuses on the history of global
imc, it's micro-organisational workings and other things. As far as i know this
hasn't been discussed openly on any of our lists.
I've included a log of some of the irc conversation we've had, in the hope that
some of the people involved in the project, which i understand is coming to an
end could possibly respond to some of the issues and concerns expressed.
phunkee
<phunkee> Hey can anyone shed any light on an ESRC funded project that
aims to
research amongst other things the micro-organisation and working practices of
indymedia?
<phunkee> just came across this link on the esrc site
<phunkee>
http://www.esrcsocietytoday.ac.uk/ESRCInfoCentre/ViewAwardPage.aspx?data=%2fFrXHTl993r%2b%2batuUxVraBgZvVQg%2bjzpmGAca8L%2beRV6Y2ge9fW3BYQR4n6H8P5YifkfSS9YiXdBofmc%2bw7hLtlOP1ygkTN9tLE5w%2bMyYhFYPif97r0POPKgZZD%2fxC8kpVJ7JALGN1oo%2bA7308A4FjoCKN7Hmp70XoyWjWMShj83fLKNx5gUf4MMdcBh3Dql2oS85LeLMqRccDAqIzSWZstjZCu%2boBXocGLmVDdeFTAW%2fjQHNw0LKajzK2D3rHacXzWTG%2feWl7sgTFNQrBlbbuH4GLaDHQB93%2bXcELRPywMLydWUUBz6mEJJSDYxjpWtiMNWVDF1sLC4iclwstYGZOOWNt9oojre9Drytquqwse8qBYVGmo95Q%3d%3d&xu=&isAwardHolder=&isProfiled=&AwardHolderID=&Sector=
<alandawson> ....it overflowed
<phunkee> oops
<alandawson> not surprised really!
<shiar> yes, that's the 'secret' research project some people
invlolved with
london imc and working on
<shiar> you can ask zoeyou
<phunkee> http://www.tiny.cc/alGaS
<alandawson> ....well it would be good to read it when its
finished :-)
<phunkee> is there anything about it on any imc lists?
<shiar> i doubt that ;)
<shiar> not really
<shiar> they haven't been very open about it
<shiar> but they do have a list that you can have a look at
<shiar> wait a sec
<alandawson> freedom of information request then? :-)
<shiar> https://lists.aktivix.org/pipermail/alt-media-res/
<phunkee> ah cheers
<shiar> np
<alandawson> is this the action research they were talking about
:-)
<shiar> supposedly
<phunkee> i don't know about anyone else but this sounds
problematic,
particularly if they haven't been 'open' about it
* shiar nods
<phunkee> was it mentioned at the network meet
<shiar> dunno, i wasn't there
<phunkee> there are some big ethical issues here for us if we're
being
'researched' by academics
<shiar> apart from the political questions (why would the gov
fund such a
research etc.), i have concerns about what kind of info they'll use (lists, irc
logs etc.) without telling us
<shiar> yeah, you feel like being spied on :P
<phunkee> who are these academics? i'm assuming they're not
imcistas
<alandawson> it looks like its come up before :
https://lists.aktivix.org/pipermail/alt-media-res/2006-October/000078.html
<shiar> some are, funnily enough
<shiar> in an imc london meeting yes
<shiar> but noting more afaik
<alandawson> sorry, not trying to spam
* shiar notes that not many attend london meetings anymore ;)
<shiar> phunkee: if you look at the email addresses on that list
you'll know
who
<phunkee>
http://alt-media-res.clearerchannel.org/public/index.php?title=FAQ
<phunkee> nods
<scott> some discussion in a london meeting. not much further.
there is some
internal dispute in the project at times as well
<scott> it is generally going ahead tho
<scott> bit like most things: forwards a little, backwards a
little, generally
making some progress
<scott> imc is only a little part of it, not all of it by any
means
<scott> different individuals within the group have different
aims, too
* shiar nods. but still...
<phunkee> hmmmm, why hasn't this been publicised if it involves
us?
<shiar> they didn't want that afaik
<shiar> and like scott said, there has been some conflict re
this
<phunkee> any particular reason?
<shiar> it's archived on their list
<phunkee> can anyone summarise it, i ain't got time to go through
a whole list
<shiar> i heard a funny explanation once, "we are indymedia, we
don't need to
tell anyone"
<scott> hehe. that is about true, tho
<phunkee> woah
<scott> just because we communicate, doesn't mean we are good at
communication
;-)
<shiar> see this email by ionnek for example
<shiar>
https://lists.aktivix.org/pipermail/alt-media-res/2006-October/000078.html
<phunkee> that's very provocative
<shiar> the research is party about our communication mechanisms
;)
<phunkee> it's very contradictory
<shiar> would be nice if people involved could explain a bit (so
we don't make
any false accusations)
<shiar> but then they don't seem to be willing to do that
<shiar> zoeyou?
<phunkee> well their apparent lack of communication on this issue
will fuel
this
<shiar> sadly true
<scott> well, i think part of it is the project is now actually
wrapping up
soon
|<-- alandawson has left irc.indymedia.org:994 (Quit: Chatzilla
0.9.77 [Firefox
2.0.0.1/2006120814])
<scott> and also, the discussions were linked in a large way with
finance, too,
i think
<phunkee> scott: when were you aware of this 'poject'
<phunkee> project
<scott> also, london imc is quite informal at times (often)
<scott> i was aware in december 2005, i think
<scott> thru aktivix
<scott> rather than thru imc, that is
<phunkee> cos their list is hosted by aktivix?
<shiar> that's not very healthy is it?
<scott> what isn't very healthy?
<scott>
https://lists.aktivix.org/pipermail/aktivix-discuss/2005-December/000878.html
<shiar> to hear about it thru other channels
<shiar> mostly by accident it seems
<scott> well, i didn't really hear about it as just an imc thing
<shiar> true
<scott> it was about media research and they had i think 5
different projects
they wanted to work on
<scott> and imc was only one of them
* chrisc there were discussions about hosting it on aktivix also,
some people
pointed out that uk acadamic projects can get free lists on acadamic
servers...
<scott> yeah, there was a lot of discussion ;-)
<shiar> wonder if this's true tho: "who want to use their work to
funnel
<shiar> resources into projects like aktivix."
* chrisc perhaps we should ask how much money they have managed
to fullel into
which groups...
<scott> that bit was true
<scott> they tried to funnel a thousand quid (i think it was)
into aktivix....
not sure if things got completed on the aktivix end, tho
<shiar> they got some 44 grand i thinnk
<shiar> wow, that's noce
<shiar> nice
<shiar> i remeber someone saying they should have helped out indy
at the g8
<shiar> as a criticism, that is
<phunkee> i'm not comfortable with all this
* chrisc bbl
<phunkee> i don't even think it fits the criteria of ethical
social research if
we're not even aware of it
* scott has to go as well
<phunkee> they must have known people would raise these issues
<phunkee> so why didn't they engage with all this straight away,
when they put
the proposal together?!
<scott> phunkee: yes, some of them did, as i said i think that
there were
differing opinions within the group
<scott> i don't know anything about the original proposal, tho.
<scott> see you all later
<phunkee> nods, i see marion was open about it
<phunkee> :)
<phunkee> bye
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