[Anarchafeminists] [project2012] May2nd Fem Manifesto Fwd: Family / Sex Work etc

Mon May 3 10:51:29 UTC 2010

Hi,

Sorry, I am confused, where is this conversation taking place?  What is it
in response to? I am surprised to see an email from Chris Knight about
prostitution in my inbox on the anarcha feminist list!  Are people being
invited to join in with their tuppance?  I'm sure there's plenty of people
on this list who could step the level of thought up a bit but is it worth
it?

Jasper

On 3 May 2010 08:50, Chris Knight <governmentofthedead at googlemail.com>wrote:

> I am sorry if I have sounded a little sharp on this issue. Apologies
> especially to Lindsey. But I still feel neither of you are getting it.
> Let me quote Marx word for word: 'Prostitution is only a specific form
> of the universal prostitution of the worker.' So OF COURSE WE ARE
> AMBIVALENT ABOUT PROSTITUTION! WE ARE AMBIVALENT ABOUT WAGE-SLAVERY IN
> GENERAL! The goal of trade union organisation is a limited one: it
> means fighting for better conditions of work for people who are
> prostitutes (of one kind or another). Naturally, it would be better to
> abolish wage-slavery (including prostitution) altogether.
>
> The question is whether the emancipation of the working class is the
> task of the working class itself. If you think it is, then clearly
> trade union rights for prostitutes (as for other wage-slaves) is a
> first step and an absolutely necessary one.
>
> Lindsey, you say: "Of course people have rights but is it what people
> should have to do in an unalienated and free society? Should our
> highest aspiration be the unionisation of prostitutes or is there (as
> Engels said ) the need for a society where women - and men for that
> matter - don't need to sell their bodies?".
>
> So let me translate. Of course workers have have rights but is
> wage-slavery what people should have to do in an unalienated and free
> society? Should our highest aspiration be the unionisation of
> wage-slaves - or is there (as Engels said ) the need for a society
> where people don't need to hire out their bodies at all?
>
> I often hear people mutter under their breathe: 'You should only do it
> for love'. A very good idea. But why pick on sex-workers? Why lecture
> to them that they should only do it for love? How many people in other
> fields of work 'only do it for love? Most people hire out their bodies
> day after day week after week to pay the rent, pay for the shopping
> etc. Once we've abolished wage-slavery, I am sure all work will be
> done for love. Good idea. Meanwhile, though, let's not get too
> moralistic  about sexwork. I would have thought banking was just as
> immoral, yet don't we let bank-workers join trade unions! Workers in
> the arms industry too. Or do we say they are 'not really workers',
> just 'victims of the system'? That would be patronising nonsense,
> obviously. Let's show one another some elementary solidarity,
> regardless of which PARTICULAR KIND OF PROSTITUTION each of us happens
> to have been forced into by the system.
>
> By the way, just in case anyone is interested, I wrote a whole book on
> this subject. It's called 'Blood Relations: Menstruation and the
> origins of culture' (Yale University Press 1995). Most people who've
> read it say it's a very good book. It's about how our ancestors dealt
> with similar problems during the 'human revolution' which occurred in
> Africa some hundred thousand years ago. We abolished prostitution
> once. We can do it again. But it will need a revolution -- a
> repetition on a higher scale of the one in which our species was born.
> The message of my book is that language, kinship and culture emerged
> on the picket line. Now as in the distant past, everyone is welcome to
> join. No moralistic hang-ups, no elitism and no exclusions, please.
> We're all in this together.
>
> Chris
>
> On 25 April 2010 12:02, Mark Barrett <marknbarrett at googlemail.com> wrote:
> > Hi Everyone
> >
> > Some might be interested in exchange below.
> >
> > Hopefully many people will attend the May2nd event (the day after
> > coming to Meltdown!) see, for more information
> >
> http://www.counterfire.org/index.php/theory/133-counterforum/4676-public-event-a-feminist-manifesto-for-the-21st-century
> > and then we may even get some extra feminist revolutionary campers for
> > Parliament Square..
> >
> > Cheers
> >
> > Mark
> >
> > ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> > Hi Mark, sorry I've taken so long to get back to you. Was on holiday
> > when you wrote and it got stuck in a backlog. I tend to agree with you
> > about sex work _ of course people have rights but is it what people
> > should have to do in an unalienated and free society? Should our
> > highest aspiration be the unionisation of prostitutes or is there (as
> > Engels said ) the need for a society where women -and men for that
> > matter - don't need to sell their bodies? And you're right that the
> > privatised family is at the centre of these questions.
> >
> > We're having another feminist manifesto meeting on Sunday 2nd May 5pm
> > at SOAS room G2 if you're interested. You're very welcome.
> >
> > best,
> >
> > Lindsey
> >
> > ________________________________
> > Date: Mon, 5 Apr 2010 21:32:03 +0100
> > Subject: Family
> > From: marknbarrett at googlemail.com
> > To: Lindsey German
> >
> > Dear Lindsey
> >
> > Just a quick note to follow our earlier exchange via Chris Knight, by
> > saying that personally I am ambivalent about sex work.
> >
> > On the one hand people should be protected as workers, while on the
> > other for me the whole sex and porn world, like environmental
> > degradation and cruelty in general are all signs that patriarchy and
> > the moral dead end capitalist mode of production it happily co-exists
> > with still exists, its salient features being the objectification and
> > commodification of the natural world in general for the benefit of the
> > powerful few and to the disadvantage of the weak and those without the
> > power of arms / money /access to the corridors of power at their
> > disposal. The sex industry - like all the industries based on
> > exploitative power relations - should be resisted, but at the same
> > time its workers - like mother nature as a whole- protected.
> >
> > Is that too contradictory? I am still trying to work this out, I find
> > the issue immensely difficult - rather as with abortion. Perhaps the
> > two strands relate to the need for regulation and reform, but also at
> > the same time social revolution otherwise we end up with at best only
> > protection but no paradigmatic liberation. Which is why, for me the
> > aim of a historic break with the privatised family - interestingly
> > students at the secondary school where I work instinctively understand
> > this point when I broach it with them - is by far the most interesting
> > and potentially pivotal prospect.
> >
> > Interested to know where you are at with the Manifesto project, and
> > looking forward to being able to assist you in some way. Please do
> > keep me posted...
> >
> >
> > Best wishes
> >
> > Mark
> > www.meltodown.uk.net
> > Watch this nice video about Election
> > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X92f7H1vrJU
> > And Bring Pop Up Tents!!
> >
> > --
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> >
>
>
>
> --
> Chris Knight
>
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-- 
click, whir.

Jasper Murphy
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