[g8-sheffield] Re: g8-sheffield Digest, Vol 4, Issue 49
IAN WALLACE
ian.wallace15 at btopenworld.com
Wed Jun 22 11:45:57 BST 2005
Well: there are a lot of people who think mass mobilisation means doing
what you're told and following a party line. Of course, plenty of
people believe this is the one and only way that revolution will come -
that all this wibble about freedom and autonomy is self-indulgent
nonsense, stemming from the fluffy, comfortable post-materialist
lifestyles of rich westerners. Some say it also indicates a total lack
of understanding of the nature and strength of the enemy. In the face of
capitalism, division in the ranks is not a luxury the oppressed can afford.
(There's a good example of this in a recent post to Indymedia about the
clown's frivolity vs South American unity, resolve and self-sacrifice -
http://www.indymedia.org.uk/en/regions/sheffield/2005/06/314158.html)
Many of us - myself included - refuse to submit to any 'mass
mobilisation' if we are required to give up our freedom. Mass
mobilisation requires obedience to authority. Not doing that. If
someone gains my trust and respect, then I will listen to them and act
with them in solidarity: that's power-with, not power-over. I won't
march in an army, proletarian or otherwise. I won't follow behind
someone claiming to know the truth about the nature of social forces,
any more than I would follow a priest who claimed to hold the truth
about my soul. All these claims - that there's one truth, and it's
Marx's / the Bible's / science's / and anyway, stop asking questions,
you're part of a mass mobilisation, not a thinker - they're all from the
same style of politics.
Hell - a lot more arguing and discussion to be done! Last point,
though: people who believe in a command economy tend also to believe in
command society & command democracy - democratic centralism. But people
have always exchanged, and always traded. Exchange emerges naturally -
as it does in prisons, as it did in Auschwitz even. What neoliberalism
does is to dismember exchange from society - turning everything into
money machines. Property, goods, resources - human resources included -
'services', ideas, programs, genes... all devices for turning energy
into pure capital...
We can claim all that back for ourselves - but I don't think we need any
mass mobilisation to do it. Aw f**k - it's a big leftie tiff that's
been going on for bloody years... let's see if we can discuss it in
civility.
See ya
Dan
----
Thanks very much Dan. I think I see where you and others are coming from now.
As I see it, the whole point of a 'mass mobilisation' is precisely that nobody (or everybody) is in control. It becomes a whole new ball game.
Just because a whole lot of people are selling Socialist Worker on the mass mobilisation does not mean that we are 'in control'. Everybody does their own thing. And everybody learns.
Do you fancy a coffee? I've just bought 2 200g jars of Percol Perfect Coffee for only £1-50 each.
Ian
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Today's Topics:
1. we are terrorists, apparently (dougald hine)
2. Thoughts for the future (IAN WALLACE)
3. Mass mobilisation... (Dan)
4. Filthy Radical Show - Thurs 12 to 1: come n help! (Dan)
5. Next Stop Gleneagles (Helen and Nick)
6. Re: Hurrah for More Meetings! (jgibbon at wimbledon.ac.uk)
7. and now for something nice from 0742.. (zerosevenfour two)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Tue, 21 Jun 2005 12:49:33 +0100
From: dougald hine
Subject: [g8-sheffield] we are terrorists, apparently
To: "List for organising protests at the G8 meeting in Sheffield."
Message-ID:
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Well, it's official, we now feature on the MIPT Terrorism Knowledge
Base: A Comprehensive Databank of Global Terrorist Incidents and
Organisations! But how did the idiot from Associated Press get the
idea that there were only 20 protestors?
http://www.tkb.org/NewsStory.jsp?storyID=71068
--
Dougald Hine
46 Alderson Road, Sheffield S2 4UD
(+44)(0)7810 650213
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Tue, 21 Jun 2005 15:47:33 +0100 (BST)
From: IAN WALLACE
Subject: [g8-sheffield] Thoughts for the future
To: g8-sheffield at lists.aktivix.org
Message-ID: <20050621144733.86700.qmail at web86604.mail.ukl.yahoo.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
What is wrong with mass mobilisation? Insurection has 2 'r's.
Ian
g8-sheffield-request at lists.aktivix.org wrote:Send g8-sheffield mailing list submissions to
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Today's Topics:
1. Thoughts for the future... (Dan)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Tue, 21 Jun 2005 11:20:56 +0100
From: Dan
Subject: [g8-sheffield] Thoughts for the future...
To: g8-sheffield at lists.aktivix.org, SSF
Message-ID: <42B7EA08.5020207 at aktivix.org>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
Hey up,
When criticisms are made of another's writing, it would be lovely if -
a) they were done in a spirit of solidarity, because
b) if you read *all* the post, the sentiments of the writer are wholly
supportive, really exciting and visionary.
They even specifically say, for example, that they don't believe in
old-fashioned 'mass-mobilisation' (which someone accused them of, when
mentioning 'harnessing...'), and their discussion of the anarchists is
full of hope and joy.
Also - the reference to filthy dirty radicals: I'm suspecting that's
partly because that's how we were referring to ourselves. We even had
two outings of the Filthy Radical Radio Show on Sheffield Live FM.
(being played again, today I think - 87.7fm!) That's merely a
reflection of not taking ourselves too seriously, and having a good
time. (Anyone doubting that humour isn't one of the most powerful of
political weapons hasn't seen any Bill Hicks or Rob Newman...)
It is, though, a sad truth that one or two words written in haste can
cause offence. If I were sixteen or thereabouts, I would get very upset
if someone called me a little anything...! Which is why I always read
back ALL e-mails and posts I write to myself, and try not to write
anything when drunk!
So a big 'woo hoo!' to the spirit, hope and love of the writer. And
here's to a Massive Alternative Terrain of Insurection, Love and Direct
Action...
Dan
------------------------------
_______________________________________________
http://www.sheffield.dissent.org.uk/
http://wiki.sheffieldsocialforum.org.uk/G8
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Message: 3
Date: Tue, 21 Jun 2005 16:11:52 +0100
From: Dan
Subject: [g8-sheffield] Mass mobilisation...
To: g8-sheffield at lists.aktivix.org
Message-ID: <42B82E37.4020409 at aktivix.org>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
I checked the spelling of insurection as well... maybe my computer
allows both. But cheers.
IAN WALLACE wrote:
> What is wrong with mass mobilisation? Insurection has 2 'r's.
> Ian
> */g8-sheffield-request at lists.aktivix.org/* wrote:
>
> Send g8-sheffield mailing list submissions to
> g8-sheffield at lists.aktivix.org
>
> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> http://lists.aktivix.org/mailman/listinfo/g8-sheffield
> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> g8-sheffield-request at lists.aktivix.org
>
> You can reach the person managing the list at
> g8-sheffield-owner at lists.aktivix.org
>
> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> than "Re: Contents of g8-sheffield digest..."
>
>
> Today's Topics:
>
> 1. Thoughts for the future... (Dan)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Tue, 21 Jun 2005 11:20:56 +0100
> From: Dan
> Subject: [g8-sheffield] Thoughts for the future...
> To: g8-sheffield at lists.aktivix.org, SSF
> Message-ID: <42B7EA08.5020207 at aktivix.org>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
>
> Hey up,
>
> When criticisms are made of another's writing, it would be lovely if -
>
> a) they were done in a spirit of solidarity, because
>
> b) if you read *all* the post, the sentiments of the writer are
> wholly
> supportive, really exciting and visionary.
>
> They even specifically say, for example, that they don't believe in
> old-fashioned 'mass-mobilisation' (which someone accused them of,
> when
> mentioning 'harnessing...'), and their discussion of the
> anarchists is
> full of hope and joy.
>
> Also - the reference to filthy dirty radicals: I'm suspecting that's
> partly because that's how we were referring to ourselves. We even had
> two outings of the Filthy Radical Radio Show on Sheffield Live FM.
> (being played again, today I think - 87.7fm!) That's merely a
> reflection of not taking ourselves too seriously, and having a good
> time. (Anyone doubting that humour isn't one of the most powerful of
> political weapons hasn't seen any Bill Hicks or Rob Newman...)
>
> It is, though, a sad truth that one or two words written in haste can
> cause offence. If I were sixteen or thereabouts, I would get very
> upset
> if someone called me a little anything...! Which is why I always read
> back ALL e-mails and posts I write to myself, and try not to write
> anything when drunk!
>
> So a big 'woo hoo!' to the spirit, hope and love of the writer. And
> here's to a Massive Alternative Terrain of Insurection, Love and
> Direct
> Action...
>
> Dan
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
> http://www.sheffield.dissent.org.uk/
> http://wiki.sheffieldsocialforum.org.uk/G8
> g8-sheffield mailing list
> g8-sheffield at lists.aktivix.org
> http://lists.aktivix.org/mailman/listinfo/g8-sheffield
>
>
> End of g8-sheffield Digest, Vol 4, Issue 48
> *******************************************
>
>------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>_______________________________________________
>http://www.sheffield.dissent.org.uk/
>http://wiki.sheffieldsocialforum.org.uk/G8
>g8-sheffield mailing list
>g8-sheffield at lists.aktivix.org
>http://lists.aktivix.org/mailman/listinfo/g8-sheffield
>
>
------------------------------
Message: 4
Date: Tue, 21 Jun 2005 16:57:23 +0100
From: Dan
Subject: [g8-sheffield] Filthy Radical Show - Thurs 12 to 1: come n
help!
To: Sheffield Inymedia Kollective ,
g8-sheffield at lists.aktivix.org
Message-ID: <42B838E3.9090307 at aktivix.org>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
Hey up,
The Filthy Radical Show is back on, this Thursday from 12 to 1. So -
1. Tune in: 87.7 fm
2. Do you want to join in? Either come in to the studio n shout from
the back, have a chat about something close to your heart, bring in a
favourite filthy radical track (like... er, the punk version of Fraggle
Rock we played last time!) - giz an e-mail or a call on 07968 997861.
We haven't planned meeting up yet, but probably will about two hours
before the showv or sommat.
3. Has anyone got any good audio suggestions? We're after good
political songs, things like Bushwhacked, etc... I can come n copy
em... just don't tell anyone, coz it's illegal.
see ya
Dan
------------------------------
Message: 5
Date: Tue, 21 Jun 2005 21:21:33 +0100 (BST)
From: Helen and Nick
Subject: [g8-sheffield] Next Stop Gleneagles
To: g8-sheffield at lists.aktivix.org
Message-ID: <20050621202133.27982.qmail at web86910.mail.ukl.yahoo.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
This is also to go up on the g8 sheffield frontpage of
the website.
No Rest for the Wicked - Next Stop Gleneagles
Now the G8 Ministerial meeting is over in Sheffield
talk is turning to sorting ourselves out for the G8
summit in Gleneagles, Scotland. Some people involved
in the Sheffield Against the G8 network are planning
to hook up in Scotland. The plan so far is to be
largely based at the rural convergence site organised
by the Dissent Network.
This rural convergence site will consist of small
'villages' or 'neighbourhoods' with each one based
around a kitchen capable of feeding a hundred (or many
more) people. This village structure will be an
integral part of the consensus decision making process
on the site. Neighbourhoods can have a particular
theme and some are based on geography - for example
Manchester and Leeds. Our aim is to have a South
Yorkshire neighbourhood, most likely in conjunction
with another area so we can pool kitchen resources and
the like. We think this might be a really cool thing
to do, so that people travelling to Scotland have the
opportunity to meet up and 'work' with other people
from South Yorkshire, and create the possibility of
building alliances in the region for the future. There
will be a dedicated phone for the Sheffield
Neighbourhood. To contact us while in Scotland call
07913779976.
Transport is everyone's shared headache. We are
considering trying to see if we can afford to hire one
or more minibuses to go up to Scotland, most likely
for the full week of actions covering 2-8 July at
least. If you are interested in possibility of getting
a minibus together with others from Sheffield email
the list with "TRANSPORT SCOTLAND" giving the dates
you would ideally want to go, so we can gauge interest
- no promises though!!!!
___________________________________________________________
How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday
snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos http://uk.photos.yahoo.com
------------------------------
Message: 6
Date: Tue, 21 Jun 2005 22:09:17 +0100 (BST)
From: jgibbon at wimbledon.ac.uk
Subject: Re: [g8-sheffield] Hurrah for More Meetings!
To: "Dan"
Cc: g8-sheffield at lists.aktivix.org
Message-ID:
<1065.81.159.128.106.1119388157.squirrel at ssl.wimbledon.ac.uk>
Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1
Sorry I couldn't make the meeting - pass on the news, or as much as can be
put on the net. Are any more meetings planned?
Jill
1. Massive Alternative Terrain of Insurection, Love and Direct Action is
> beautiful! Insurection! Love! Diect Action! Wicked. Anything as
> bourgeoise as love will immediately act as a talisman against Trots, so
> I thoroughly approve...
>
> 2. Meeting last night - not sure what I can say on the list. Except to
> ask - when we said this list would be used to discuss the Massive
> Alternative Terrain of Insurection, Love and Direct Action (working
> title pending group consensus work with paper, post-its and sticky
> dots...!) - can we start writing about ideas on the list now? Can
> someone write to the list and explain the change of use? I'm happy to
> do that, if people think it's a good plan still. Could be a good way of
> brainstorming stuff...
>
> love to y'all (lots of it)
>
> Dan
> ----
>
> fabian wrote:
>
>> hello you hard debating lot from Tarifa....
>> I just wanted to make a proposal for tonights meeting to call the new
>> space M.A.T.I.L.D.A which stands for
>> Massive Alternative Terrain of Insurection, Love and Direct Action
>>
>> have fun you filthy radicals
>>
>> Fabian
>>
>>
>>
>> Am 19.06.2005 um 22:30 schrieb julie w:
>>
>>> Hey kids,
>>>
>>> Meeting 7pm at Convergence Centre (Old yourkshire arts space, matilda
>>> rd) on monday (the 20th) 'The Future of this Space' (ie are we going
>>> to keep an activist/community/art/party space going here)
>>> then from 8.30 G8 in Scotland - lovely plans - transport, meeting
>>> for action etc
>>> See you there!
>>> Julie xxx
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> http://www.sheffield.dissent.org.uk/
>>> http://wiki.sheffieldsocialforum.org.uk/G8
>>> g8-sheffield mailing list
>>> g8-sheffield at lists.aktivix.org
>>> http://lists.aktivix.org/mailman/listinfo/g8-sheffield
>>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> http://www.sheffield.dissent.org.uk/
>> http://wiki.sheffieldsocialforum.org.uk/G8
>> g8-sheffield mailing list
>> g8-sheffield at lists.aktivix.org
>> http://lists.aktivix.org/mailman/listinfo/g8-sheffield
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> http://www.sheffield.dissent.org.uk/
> http://wiki.sheffieldsocialforum.org.uk/G8
> g8-sheffield mailing list
> g8-sheffield at lists.aktivix.org
> http://lists.aktivix.org/mailman/listinfo/g8-sheffield
>
------------------------------
Message: 7
Date: Tue, 21 Jun 2005 16:45:05 +0000
From: "zerosevenfour two"
Subject: [g8-sheffield] and now for something nice from 0742..
To: g8-sheffield at lists.aktivix.org, adam at diamat.org.uk,
amparo.gutierrez at tiscali.co.uk, Angeltime at btopenworld.com,
chris at aktivix.org, c.malins at sheffield.ac.uk,
colette_cameron at yahoo.co.uk, dan at aktivix.org, deacondave at onetel.com,
fab at in-no.org, johncsmith at btinternet.com, machinevman at hotmail.com,
matthewtrevelyan at hotmail.com, rosehodgson at lycos.com,
sheffield at indymedia.org, ssf at lists.aktivix.org
Message-ID:
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed
well befor i go ill send you all love with this
http://peace.lowtech.org/g8/index.html a shourt film made over the days of
g8 edited sunday monday html other bits tuesday hope you enjoy hope to have
them showing here in the uk at sharow festival watch this space.. if there
are any people up for some cleaning 2 morow wed from 12 noon then e mail of
list if you are comeing ring the bell of course we will be slow in our reply
oh slow summer days what a 2 weeks that has been oh the joy anger fear and
then matilda come alive nice one fab for the name..
0742
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