[HacktionLab] Recommendations for modern web dev environments

[Mike Harris]

On 25/06/2013 18:47, Charlie Harvey wrote:
> On 25/06/13 12:08, Mike Harris wrote:
> > Hi List,
>
> > We sort of covered some of this when discussing alternatives to
> > Wordpress or static HTML prior to BarnCamp, but I thought I'd throw this
> > out there again to any of you programmers out there.
>
> > I'm looking to re-write a hotpotch system, written in mySQL+Perl+JS with
> > some Jquery and some PHP, in a new platform/framework.
>
> > We need to link in with 2D real-time drawing tools, have CRM-style
> > management, have a full invoicing and billing system, a shopping cart,
> > graphical and numerical reporting and hierarchical user role/permissions
> > management.  We also have complex forms and need to be able to save and
> > restore form states, possibly on the client to then send to the server
>
> > There are some pretty good JS based stuff out there for doing the 2D
> > stuff, in native HTML5 SVG and Canvas support, but what components or
> > programming environment would you choose, what can you recommend that
> > balances power with learning curve with being cutting edge, but a stable
> > enough API.
>
> > So far I've looked at the possibility of hanging it off Drupal + Drupal
> > Commerce + CiviCRM and glueing that together to something like the
> > backbone.js stack and the 2D drawing stuff.
>
> > But I'm not convinced about that, as Drupal Commerce and Civi do not
> > seem to glue together very well, and Civi is very non-profit orientated
> > and therefore doesn't have support for sales and invoicing - although we
> > could obviously write that module and contribute it.
>
> > I'm wondering if it's entirely possible to do it all in JS, or mostly in
> > JS, and if that's wise.  Am thinking some kind of stack like Marionette
> > + Underscore + Backbone + JQuery communicating with Node.js on the back
> > end.  I've briefly glanced at Coffeescript, Require.js, Ember.js,
> > Handlebars.js, and then there's Rhino, etc, there's so much to
> choose from.
>
> > What would you do?  What would you recommend?
>
> Hi,
>
> The whole js stack thing is /apparently/ do-able, but if it was me I'd
> be looking for systems with good APIs that I could glue together and
> concentrate my effort on that bit. Because its mostly gluing bits you
> probably want something more lightweight than the framework I know best,
> catalyst.
>
> Maybe SugarCRM is worth a look instead of Civi?
>
> Magento works pretty well for the sorts of shopping sites we do
> (http://foeshop.co.uk, http://amnestyshop.org.uk,
> http://shop.newint.org/uk/); its got a REST API, though we mostly use
> XML. You can make custom modules for it (in php) or you can pay someone
> to do it for you. It can be tricky to scale but its got a very flexible
> architecture.
>
> I've heard good things about mojolicious (which is a lightweight perl
> realtime framework), and might work well for your perl guys, but
> node.js, or django or whatever would do the job. You basically don't
> need it to do anything other than move data between your main systems,
> and maybe provide a front end for your users.
>
> We're looking to redo our site architecture this year[*], so be
> interested if you fancy sharing your findings...
>
> Well that's my 0.5pworth
>
> Cheers,
>
> [*] We're looking at Yii (php), Django (python), Node (js), Catalyst
> (perl) and Drupal (php) IIRC
>
> > Before you suggest it, all learning Java is not within the time-frame.
> > Ideally PHP and JS would be what we'd like to use, Ruby is a possibility
> > though, perhaps Plone/Zope/Python, and of course there's always Perl.
>
> > Cheers,
>
> > Mike.
>
Thanks Charlie, an useful response.

We've had a loose evaluation between Drupal and Magento, with some fancy
JS stuff done in Backbone.js and the stack above that (i.e.
Underscore.js and Marionette), with some of the server side processing
done in Node.js.  It kind of seems like Drupal Commerce could offer a
basis, but really would need a lot of work, that perhaps Magento doesn't
require.  CiviCRM is cool, but it's aimed at not-for-profits, so doesn't
handle invoicing for example.  In some senses perhaps a fully fledged
CRM is too much and really a Drupal Content Type for Customers linked to
another one for Orders, and another for Leads, etc, would be enough....
the jury is still out.

We took a look at Sugar, but decided that they had a nasty licensing
model and worrying had withdrawn loads of features in a one fell swoop
back in 2010 when they reneged the GPL on them.  Also it seems like it's
written in a circa 2004 code base and therefore is a bit of a tangled
mare of code.  Another one was Zurmo.org, but all it really seems to do
is to replace something like Exchange, which is already in use anyway.

Anyhow, thanks for your feedback Charlie and I'll update you on where
these investigations lead.

BTW: I have looked at Jii before and it looks cool, anyone here actually
done anything with it?

Cheers,

Mike.

p.s. I know this is a bit work orientated, and hopefully that's
forgiveable, but if not, I'll get myself on Underscore instead.
>
>
>
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-- 
Mike Harris
w: http://mbharris.co.uk
t: +44 7811 671 893
0: http://mbharris.co.uk/keys/pgp.html