[SSC] SSC Digest, Vol 11, Issue 9
Amsler, Sarah
S.S.AMSLER at aston.ac.uk
Mon Nov 14 23:01:59 UTC 2011
Edwin, very many thanks indeed for your recent thoughts, which helped to clarify some points in my own mind as well. I hope you'll be able to make the meeting on Saturday so we can chat in person.
Sandie, sure. I can be flexible as well. Although, how exciting...suddenly spoilt by and torn between spaces and activities, it seems! I would also personally like to visit the square at some point, having now learned of it, and am sure we can work something out. I'm not sure whether Laylah will be with me again or not; it depends on whether I come up on Friday or Saturday, but in any case I'm happy to be with the kids for a while.
Best,
Sarah
Dr Sarah S Amsler
Lecturer in Sociology
Aston University
Birmingham, B4 7ET, UK
+44 (0) 121 204 3072
s.s.amsler at aston.ac.uk
Campaign for the Public University: http://publicuniversity.org.uk
________________________________________
From: ssc-bounces at lists.aktivix.org [ssc-bounces at lists.aktivix.org] on behalf of ssc-request at lists.aktivix.org [ssc-request at lists.aktivix.org]
Sent: Monday, November 14, 2011 10:54 PM
To: ssc at lists.aktivix.org
Subject: SSC Digest, Vol 11, Issue 9
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Today's Topics:
1. Re: SSC Digest, Vol 11, Issue 7 (Edwin Bacon)
2. Nov 19th, Croft St (Sandie Stratford)
3. Re: Nov 19th, Croft St (Joss Winn)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Mon, 14 Nov 2011 13:54:02 -0000
From: "Edwin Bacon" <edwin at baconweb.co.uk>
To: "'Amsler, Sarah'" <S.S.AMSLER at aston.ac.uk>,
<ssc at lists.aktivix.org>
Subject: Re: [SSC] SSC Digest, Vol 11, Issue 7
Message-ID: <003501cca2d4$e0fc4f60$a2f4ee20$@baconweb.co.uk>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Thanks, Sarah, for your thoughtful response.
Yes, you're right and I should clarify.
I joined the SSC to offer an alternative for potential students in my local
community who want a university-level education without taking on debt. I
didn't sign up to any statement of political views other than the SSC's
statement of values. Beyond this, political stance should not inhibit
engagement in the SSC any more than it is allowed to inhibit employment in a
university. This seems clear in the SSC's statement of values, and as soon
as we become a group with a particular political stance other than these
broad values we forfeit any claim to offering a university experience.
>From this starting point, I'm very uncomfortable with public blogs stating
that the SSC has a particular political position. I would take this view
whether I agreed with the position in question or not. We can all hold our
political views, and blog about them if we want, but we shouldn't claim them
as SSC's views and aims.
I didn't want my email to start an online debate on the substance of
Richard's blogpost partly for the reasons you set out around the inadequacy
of email for such a purpose, but mainly because I would see detailed debate
about, for example, the reconceptualisation of the politics of production
and the precarity of capital, as outwith the central activity of the SSC and
alien to the more politically inclusive view of the SSC that I hold.
Edwin
-----Original Message-----
From: ssc-bounces at lists.aktivix.org [mailto:ssc-bounces at lists.aktivix.org]
On Behalf Of Amsler, Sarah
Sent: 11 November 2011 21:05
To: ssc at lists.aktivix.org
Subject: Re: [SSC] SSC Digest, Vol 11, Issue 7
Hello all,
Thanks to Edwin and Richard for these comments, and Richard for sharing your
blogpost. I've also been thinking about the question of consensus and public
'representation' (with all that entails, even if it aims not to represent in
the classical sense), so would welcome an opportunity to discuss it next
week. I think this is a question that is bigger than the Social Science
Centre, and something that may be new to some of us -- for example, speaking
personally, having been in positions where I largely have had either
'authority' to speak or the need only to represent my own positions -- so I
think it could be useful to open it up. I think this is in fact something
that we began to discuss at our last meeting with a conversation on how to
articulate even the broadest of guiding principles in inclusive and
cooperative ways.
I've also only been to one of the two meetings thus far, but my
understanding is that all the questions Edwin raises are currently, and
perhaps ongoing, matters of discussion and debate within the group. I would
expect them to be for a while. Speaking only for myself again, they are in
fact questions that even individuals may be working through for themselves.
I read very clearly in your post, Edwin, that you'd rather avoid a debate on
the questions you raise and would like to respect that -- particularly over
email, which I think can be a pretty inadequate medium for such discussions,
especially amongst a group of people who don't already have a history of
communication. I think it would be a mistake to assume or demand that
everyone involved wants to engage in the same ways (which is I think part of
what you're arguing, and from what Richard has written below think is
something he also believes). But I do think that you raise some hugely
important points and questions that are central to the work of the Centre,
and for both people whose positions resonate and those whose don't -- they
are complex, critical, and we are prone to gloss them one way or the other.
I would thus personally like to discuss and listen to others' ideas about
them, so wonder if you wouldn't mind if we take up Richard's offer to raise
them at the next meeting for whomever would like to discuss?
Best wishes,
Sarah
Dr Sarah S Amsler
Lecturer in Sociology
Aston University
Birmingham, B4 7ET, UK
+44 (0) 121 204 3072
s.s.amsler at aston.ac.uk
Campaign for the Public University: http://publicuniversity.org.uk
________________________________________
From: ssc-bounces at lists.aktivix.org [ssc-bounces at lists.aktivix.org] on
behalf of ssc-request at lists.aktivix.org [ssc-request at lists.aktivix.org]
Sent: Friday, November 11, 2011 5:15 PM
To: ssc at lists.aktivix.org
Subject: SSC Digest, Vol 11, Issue 7
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ssc at lists.aktivix.org
To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
https://lists.aktivix.org/mailman/listinfo/ssc
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When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than
"Re: Contents of SSC digest..."
Today's Topics:
1. Re: teach-in (Edwin Bacon)
2. FW: teach-in (Richard Hall)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Fri, 11 Nov 2011 17:11:05 -0000
From: "Edwin Bacon" <edwin at baconweb.co.uk>
To: <ssc at lists.aktivix.org>
Subject: Re: [SSC] teach-in
Message-ID: <003c01cca094$e61324c0$b2396e40$@baconweb.co.uk>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Thanks for this Richard,
How much of what you blogged is what we have agreed as a cooperative? Do we
have a position that students become revolutionary, and that we aim to
demonstrate the precarity of capital?
Does the SSC aim to understand how we can create meaningful criteria for
learning and teaching that are not alienating or symbolically violent? Has
the SSC decided that what we are doing is an act of political refusal?
I'm not primarily asking to instigate a debate on the substance of these
issues - in fact, I'd rather like to avoid one. More mundanely, I'm asking
to get clarity on whether they are agreed positions of the SSC.
I joined to teach students who don't want to get into debt. I didn't know
that we had much beyond that in terms of a political position, but it always
possible that I've missed something, having only been able to get to one
meeting so far.
Edwin
From: ssc-bounces at lists.aktivix.org [mailto:ssc-bounces at lists.aktivix.org]
On Behalf Of Richard Hall
Sent: 10 November 2011 17:21
To: ssc at lists.aktivix.org
Subject: [SSC] teach-in
Hi,
I spoke at a teach-out for Tent City University yesterday about the Social
Science Centre. I blogged about it here:
http://www.learnex.dmu.ac.uk/2011/11/10/a-teach-in-at-tent-city-university-a
nd-the-struggle-for-alternatives/
There are some issues I raised about student-as-producer and the curriculum
that we need to nail. But I wanted to raise them as issues. I also blatantly
ripped-off some stuff from the quality paper that Sara/Sarah drafted.
Note that Mike spoke last week:
http://www.livescribe.com/cgi-bin/WebObjects/LDApp.woa/wa/MLSOverviewPage?si
d=PZ8CqlBrJ9r1
We have some good friends and comrades at TCU. I had a good chat afterwards,
before and on the march. I think they will be amenable to more engagements
with us.
Best wishes,
Richard.
Dr Richard Hall,
National Teaching Fellow (2009), and Reader in Education and Technology.
Head of Enhancing Learning through Technology, Department of Library and
Learning Services.
DE MONTFORT UNIVERSITY.
T: +44 (0) 116 207 8254
E: rhall1 at dmu.ac.uk SKYPE/TWITTER/YouTube: hallymk1
W:: dmu.ac.uk <http://www.dmu.ac.uk/>
Learning Exchanges @ DMU: http://www.learnex.dmu.ac.uk/
DMU is Home to Mile2 which, in partnership with the Mayor's office, is using
DMU skills, knowledge and student volunteers to make a positive impact on a
local Leicester community.
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Message: 2
Date: Fri, 11 Nov 2011 17:13:08 -0000
From: "Richard Hall" <RHall1 at dmu.ac.uk>
To: <ssc at lists.aktivix.org>
Subject: [SSC] FW: teach-in
Message-ID:
<290C0FAF9352E54EB483CBA4ED12133C05A1071C at artemis.LEC-ADMIN.dmu.ac.uk>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Hi Edwin,
It's my take on it. And it is positioned very specifically and very
politically. I'm not sure it has been agreed, but I have ripped off some of
the position papers.
That said, you are right to raise the issues of consensus for what we say in
public about the SSC [this has worried me if I am honest]. Would you like me
to raise these next Saturday? I would be very happy to take part in a
conversation about them.
However, whilst I do see the SSC as an avowedly political project, I
recognise that it is just one position.
Have a good weekend.
Richard.
From: Edwin Bacon [mailto:edwin at baconweb.co.uk]
Sent: 11 November 2011 16:55
To: Richard Hall
Subject: RE: [SSC] teach-in
Thanks for this Richard,
How much of what you blogged is what we have agreed as a cooperative? Do we
now have a position that students become revolutionary, and that we aim to
demonstrate the precarity of capital?
Does the SSC aim to understand how we can create meaningful criteria for
learning and teaching that are not alienating or symbolically violent?
Has the SSC decided that what we are doing is an act of political refusal?
I'm not primarily asking to instigate a debate on the substance of these
issues - in fact, I'd rather like to avoid one. More mundanely, I'm asking
to get clarity on whether they are agreed positions of the SSC.
I joined to teach students who don't want to get into debt. I didn't know
that we had much beyond that in terms of a political position, but it always
possible that I've missed something, having only been able to get to one
meeting so far.
Edwin
From: ssc-bounces at lists.aktivix.org
[mailto:ssc-bounces at lists.aktivix.org] On Behalf Of Richard Hall
Sent: 10 November 2011 17:21
To: ssc at lists.aktivix.org
Subject: [SSC] teach-in
Hi,
I spoke at a teach-out for Tent City University yesterday about the Social
Science Centre. I blogged about it here:
http://www.learnex.dmu.ac.uk/2011/11/10/a-teach-in-at-tent-city-universi
ty-and-the-struggle-for-alternatives/
There are some issues I raised about student-as-producer and the curriculum
that we need to nail. But I wanted to raise them as issues. I also blatantly
ripped-off some stuff from the quality paper that Sara/Sarah drafted.
Note that Mike spoke last week:
http://www.livescribe.com/cgi-bin/WebObjects/LDApp.woa/wa/MLSOverviewPag
e?sid=PZ8CqlBrJ9r1
We have some good friends and comrades at TCU. I had a good chat afterwards,
before and on the march. I think they will be amenable to more engagements
with us.
Best wishes,
Richard.
Dr Richard Hall,
National Teaching Fellow (2009), and Reader in Education and Technology.
Head of Enhancing Learning through Technology, Department of Library and
Learning Services.
DE MONTFORT UNIVERSITY.
T: +44 (0) 116 207 8254
E: rhall1 at dmu.ac.uk SKYPE/TWITTER/YouTube: hallymk1
W:: dmu.ac.uk <http://www.dmu.ac.uk/>
Learning Exchanges @ DMU: http://www.learnex.dmu.ac.uk/
DMU is Home to Mile2 which, in partnership with the Mayor's office, is using
DMU skills, knowledge and student volunteers to make a positive impact on a
local Leicester community.
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Message: 2
Date: Mon, 14 Nov 2011 22:45:55 -0000
From: "Sandie Stratford" <sandiestrat at phonecoop.coop>
To: <ssc at lists.aktivix.org>
Subject: [SSC] Nov 19th, Croft St
Message-ID: <BEFA04DD9A5842699E2484A758A96703 at DellUserPC>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Hi all
Having offered to work with the children for the first hour, I wonder if I could do a swap with someone? I will open up at 11.45am with Ray the manager, and will be available again from 1pm, for a plate-share lunch and a joint activity (which is still being planned!).
My dilemma stems from the fact that the newly formed #Occupy Lincoln group is meeting at Speakers Corner in City Square at 12 noon and I'd like to join them at least for an hour. We met today, and decided that 'education' is our priority, so it's 'bring a chair' (and a warm coat) and join in a discussion. I hope people will contribute short talks on whatever their expertise is: I'll say a bit about SSC unless one of you plans to come along! I feel the need to hear about the Robin Hood Tax, myself, and to be 'in the space'.
Sandie
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Message: 3
Date: Mon, 14 Nov 2011 22:54:34 +0000
From: Joss Winn <joss at josswinn.org>
To: Sandie Stratford <sandiestrat at phonecoop.coop>,
"ssc at lists.aktivix.org ssc at lists.aktivix.org" <ssc at lists.aktivix.org>
Subject: Re: [SSC] Nov 19th, Croft St
Message-ID: <1F223BC0-9592-4FF9-A96A-DC8E513FABAF at josswinn.org>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Of course, Sandie. I'll step in, as I'm sure others will be happy to do so, too.
See you at 11.45 on Saturday.
Best wishes
Joss
On 14 Nov 2011, at 22:45, Sandie Stratford wrote:
>
> Hi all
>
> Having offered to work with the children for the first hour, I wonder if I could do a swap with someone? I will open up at 11.45am with Ray the manager, and will be available again from 1pm, for a plate-share lunch and a joint activity (which is still being planned!).
>
> My dilemma stems from the fact that the newly formed #Occupy Lincoln group is meeting at Speakers Corner in City Square at 12 noon and I'd like to join them at least for an hour. We met today, and decided that 'education' is our priority, so it's 'bring a chair' (and a warm coat) and join in a discussion. I hope people will contribute short talks on whatever their expertise is: I'll say a bit about SSC unless one of you plans to come along! I feel the need to hear about the Robin Hood Tax, myself, and to be 'in the space'.
>
> Sandie
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> SSC mailing list
> SSC at lists.aktivix.org
> https://lists.aktivix.org/mailman/listinfo/ssc
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