[imc-uk-emergency] Logs from IRC meeting 15th May 2003

[Chris Croome]

Hi

Here they are...

18:52 <@ionnek> did some questions for later:
18:53 <@ionnek> Q: which collective is ready?
18:53 <@ionnek> Q: which collective is ready?Q: What's the situation in lancester, scotland, manchester? Q: Which open publishing (OP) system do we implement on the uk startpage? Q: How do we manage the features on the uk startpage? Q: Do we want an extra "regional page" for features from "other regions"? Q: What do we need to do for the launch? Q: How do we manage the features on the uk startpage?
18:54 <@chrisc> Q: What techy things need to be done b4 the launch?
18:55  * chrisc perhaps the list of Q:'s should be sent to the emg list?
18:55 <@ionnek> well I've also definitions and proposals but thought its getting a bit anal...
18:56 <@ionnek> sent it to you
18:56 <@chrisc> if it's all sent in a email to the emg list we can just give people not on it the URI via the topic of this channel....
18:57 <@chrisc> the URI in the list archive
18:58 <@ionnek> do you want to add the tech stuff and send it?
18:58 <@chrisc> ok
18:58 <@vince> hi
18:59 <@ionnek> quick lunch...
19:00 <@vince> yup, cafeteria is quite fast...
19:00 <@vince> quite bad also unfortunately
19:03 -!- chrisc changed the topic of #uk to: agenda: http://www.email-lists.org/pipermail/imc-uk-emergency/2003-May/000124.html
19:04 <@vince> chris: how do you change the topic btw?
19:04 <@chrisc>  /topic foo
19:04 <@vince> and anyone can do it?
19:04 <@chrisc> just op's
19:05 <@vince> op's are the ones with a @ next to H
19:05 <@chrisc> yeah
19:05 <@vince> btw there are twice the first question and twice the features question... hope we won't discuss them twice... :-)
19:06 <@chrisc> oops!
19:06 <@vince> ;-)
19:06 <@chrisc> i just pasted the q's and reformatted them...
19:07 <@vince> that'S fine...
19:08 <@chrisc> shall we start? where are the others?
19:09 <@vince> don't know
19:09 <@chrisc> 1ah i have longer list to send
19:09 <@vince> should we wait for ionnek and andi
19:10 <@chrisc> yeah
19:12 -!- maqui [~jirc at 62.255.205.73] has joined #uk
19:13 <@vince> hi
19:13 < maqui> hello
19:14 <@vince> we haven't started yet
19:14 < maqui> ahhh ok i thought i was late ... again
19:14 <@vince> :-)
19:14 < maqui> btw why my name appears [machine maqui]?
19:14 -!- fidra [~AB at 62.31.77.49] has joined #uk
19:15 <@vince> well your name appears maqui to me...
19:15 <@ionnek> it dosent in my browser
19:15 <@vince> don'T know then
19:15 <@ionnek> maqui are you a cyborg?
19:15 < maqui> well then its ok, but in my window describes me as a machine ... funny that :)
19:15 <@ionnek> we're just setting up a laptop for ana...
19:15 <@vince> ok
19:16 < maqui> yep im a cyborg as the baddie in alien film :)
19:16 -!- chrisc changed the topic of #uk to: http://www.email-lists.org/pipermail/imc-uk-emergency/2003-May/000126.html
19:16 < maqui> yo fidra!
19:16 <@ionnek> hi
19:17 <@vince> hi
19:20 -!- vince is now known as vince_ox
19:20 <@vince_ox> should we start?
19:21 <@ionnek> guess so...
19:21 -!- ana [ana at 81.2.110.152] has joined #uk
19:21 <@vince_ox> hi
19:21 < ana> hi!!
19:21 <@ionnek> hellooo
19:21 < ana> so - what have we missed
19:21 <@vince_ox> ana
19:21 <@ionnek> nothing
19:21 <@vince_ox> oops
19:21 < maqui> hola
19:21 < ana> hola!
19:22 <@vince_ox> I suppose the first thing for all would be to have alook at the email (the topic of this irc channel)
19:23 < maqui> sorry which is?
19:23 -!- zcat [~chatzilla at 81.2.110.155] has joined #uk
19:23 <@vince_ox> look at the topic of this page  http://www.email-lists.org/pipermail/imc-uk-emergency/2003-May/000126.html
19:23 <@vince_ox> hi zcat
19:23 < maqui> ta
19:23 < zcat> hi
19:23 < zcat> whos machine
19:23 <@vince_ox> Tim, but he isn't here
19:24 <@vince_ox> a guy from Leeds I think
19:24 < zcat> k
19:24 -!- bal [~jirc at 80.225.24.39] has joined #uk
19:24 -!- ana is now known as ana_ldn
19:24 <@vince_ox> hi
19:24 -!- mode/#uk [-oo andi vince_ox] by ChanServ
19:24 -!- mode/#uk [-oo yossarian ionnek] by ChanServ
19:24 < ana_ldn> hi bal!
19:24 -!- mode/#uk [-o chrisc] by ChanServ
19:24 < zcat> hi bal
19:24 < maqui> yo bal
19:24 < ionnek> hi bal
19:24 < andi> just had a mail from david from liverpool hi bal
19:24 < maqui> ah zcat here ... hello
19:25 < zcat> watcha 
19:25 < zcat> hi ionnek
19:25 < maqui> ok had a look to the agenda mail ... it seems ok shall we follow it up step by step?
19:26 < vince_ox> i think we should
19:26 < zcat> soory wheres the mail
19:26 < vince_ox> topic of the irc channel
19:26 < vince_ox> http://www.email-lists.org/pipermail/imc-uk-emergency/2003-May/000126.html
19:26 < [machine]> vince_ox: i'm here for now, but working late, so i could disappear at any second, logging is on though :)
19:26 < vince_ox> hi machine! :-)
19:27 < maqui> ok 2 mins for everyone to see the above mail ok?
19:27 < vince_ox> does anyone know how to send a message to someone in particular on irssi
19:28 < maqui> you mean in this room?
19:28 < vince_ox> yup
19:28 < maqui> click at their nickname and a private window opens
19:29 < vince_ox> hmmm it's a text based irc client...
19:29 < maqui> but not too much wispering eh :))
19:29 -!- andi is now known as andi_ldn
19:29 < [machine]> vince_ox: hehe, just as i say i'm here, i get called away, i'll read the logs later
19:29 < chrisc> vince_ox: i don't know, and i don't know how to know when we get them either...
19:29 < vince_ox> [machine]: ok cool! :-) see ya
19:29 < andi_ldn> vince: type "/msg andi blabla"
19:29 < vince_ox> chrisc: did you get the last message from [machine] for example?
19:29 < chrisc> yeah
19:30 < vince_ox> andi_ldn: thanks! :-)
19:30 < vince_ox> chrisc: privates message are not the same color on irssi:-)
19:31 < andi_ldn> but about that /msg stuff - not too much whispering, he...
19:31 < zcat> answers to the questions on a postcard to po box ............. hehe
19:31 < chrisc> vince_ox: so we see all of them?
19:32 < ionnek> lets go for the postcards!
19:32 < zcat> i like the questions about lunch yum yum yum
19:33 < ionnek> how much time to we have?
19:33 < ana_ldn> can you all stop whispering aloud- and start?
19:33 < vince_ox> I gotta leave at 9pm, but you can continue indeed
19:33 < ana_ldn> i propose some one facilitates - not me
19:33 < ionnek> vince - why don't you pick a question?
19:33 < zcat> so who is ready to lunch
19:33 -!- mode/#uk [+o chrisc] by ChanServ
19:34 < zcat> launch
19:34 < vince_ox> ok who would like to facilitate? not me...
19:34 <@chrisc> i am
19:34 < vince_ox> cool
19:34 <@chrisc> not willing but ready
19:34 < ionnek> go on!
19:34 <@chrisc> no i don't want to facilitate
19:34 < ana_ldn> yes - thanks chris!
19:34 < zcat> good man yourself
19:34 <@chrisc> nooooo
19:35 < ana_ldn> zcat and i propose marion
19:35 < ionnek> I can paste in the questions
19:35 < vince_ox> thanks marion for voluntering
19:35 -!- mode/#uk [+o vince_ox] by ChanServ
19:35 -!- mode/#uk [+o ionnek] by ChanServ
19:35 <@ionnek> will need all help!
19:35 -!- mode/#uk [+o ana_ldn] by ChanServ
19:35 -!- mode/#uk [+o zcat] by ChanServ
19:36 <@ionnek> ok, vince. pick a question.
19:36 <@vince_ox> well shouldn't we do them one after the other?
19:36 <@vince_ox> in this order?
19:36 <@ionnek> ok.
19:36 <@ionnek> Q: which collective is ready?
19:36 <@zcat> ionnek ana_ldn & zcat in same room
19:36 <@zcat> london?
19:36 <@chrisc> i think sheffield is more or less :-)
19:37 -!- maqui [~jirc at 62.255.205.73] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
19:37 <@vince_ox> well technically oxford, sheffield, cambridge, leeds, london and scotland have been involved
19:37 <@ionnek> they have templates?
19:37 <@vince_ox> yes
19:37 <@vince_ox> not ready yet but in the process of
19:37 <@vince_ox> (leeds do not have yet but they will soon i guess)
19:37 <@chrisc> sheffield templates are 1/2 way there but i can fix it quite quickly
19:37 <@vince_ox> oxford templates are ready
19:38 <@ionnek> not sure about london templates.
19:38 <@vince_ox> cambridge should be ready this weekend
19:38 <@ionnek> Andi?
19:38 < andi_ldn> hang on
19:38 < andi_ldn> helpin maqui on de fone
19:38 <@zcat> andi r we ready
19:38 -!- mode/#uk [+o andi_ldn] by ChanServ
19:39 <@vince_ox> is dave here btw?
19:39 -!- Maqui0 [shadowirc at 62.255.205.73] has joined #uk
19:39 -!- Maqui0 is now known as maqui
19:40 <@ionnek> Andi, how about the london templates?
19:40 <@andi_ldn> hang on...
19:40 <@ionnek> sorry...
19:40 -!- fidra is now known as fidra_away
19:40 -!- mode/#uk [+o maqui] by ChanServ
19:41 <@ionnek> meanwhile - how do people feel about training admins?
19:41 <@ionnek> When can we start using the site in that respect?
19:41 <@vince_ox> hmm what do you mean
19:41 <@zcat> I NEED TRAINING!!!
19:41 <@ana_ldn> me too
19:41 <@ionnek> next wed in london.
19:41 <@ana_ldn> we couldn't have our training yesterday
19:42 <@ana_ldn> because of room bookings - we'll have it next week
19:42 <@vince_ox> ok fine
19:42 <@vince_ox> we should write aconcise howto for the admin section
19:42 <@maqui> hello
19:42 <@ana_ldn> hello back
19:42 <@vince_ox> hi
19:42 <@zcat> poxy mac's get areal puta
19:43 <@andi_ldn> hi maqui onl;ine in shadowirc man!
19:43 <@andi_ldn> zcat fukkoff
19:43 <@maqui> okkk ... finally managed to use one og these kool irc clients instead of explorer babylon!
19:43 <@zcat> hehe
19:43 <@zcat> cool
19:44 <@andi_ldn> reading what u mad lot hav been chattin de last 15 minutes...
19:44 <@ana_ldn> andi how about the london template?
19:44 <@andi_ldn> hang on... let me read please
19:44 <@ana_ldn> (sorry)
19:44 <@zcat> forign languages are a pain huh
19:45 <@chrisc> http://chris.atomism.croome.net/photos/2003/0215/645_London_anti-war_demo_Sm.jpg.605.html
19:45 <@zcat> que
19:45 <@chrisc> shit
19:45 <@chrisc> http://chris.croome.net/photos/2003/0215/645_London_anti-war_demo_Sm.jpg.605.html
19:45  * chrisc just a photo i found the other day...
19:46 <@zcat> pics of bloody terorists
19:46 <@ionnek> vince: good idea about howto admin. 
19:46 <@zcat> cmon lets do da buisness
19:47 <@vince_ox> andi? :-):-)
19:47 <@ionnek> well from what I've heard seems that there are admin pp ready in ox and sheffield, next week in london. 
19:47 <@maqui> yo chris ... brilliant pic innti?:)
19:47 <@maqui> hello
19:47 <@zcat> u would say that
19:47 <@chrisc> maqui: yeah, check the med and larg versions!
19:48 <@maqui> heeloooo
19:48 <@vince_ox> ionnek: agree, and maybe also in cambridge and leeds
19:48 <@ionnek> enough to start in that respect?
19:48 <@vince_ox> don'T know, we should ask them
19:48 <@ana_ldn> i personally wouldn't feel confident enough just next week
19:48 <@zcat> k
19:48 <@ana_ldn> unless there is some techie there for me
19:48 <@vince_ox> the thing is that mir is very easy to use
19:49 <@chrisc> leeds meet next week again and have discussed doing features and have started training themselves
19:49 <@vince_ox> if we provide a good explanation
19:49 -!- maqui [shadowirc at 62.255.205.73] has left #uk []
19:49 -!- maqui [shadowirc at 62.255.205.73] has joined #uk
19:49 <@chrisc> i'm sure they will be a techy here to help most of the time :-)
19:49 <@ionnek> ok - so no live b4 end of next week?
19:49 <@vince_ox> and i think dave from cambridge could do a training for his group
19:50 < maqui> srry lost all of you
19:50 < maqui> experimenting with new cient ... oppps
19:50 <@ana_ldn> chris: thanks a lot - that'd be fine then
19:50 < maqui> chris ta for pic ... great innit
19:50 <@vince_ox> ana_ldn: yup, either chris or andi or me or anyone else
19:50 <@vince_ox> there is always someone almost
19:50 < maqui> believe it or not that's me and my nephew:)
19:51 <@chrisc> maqui: ah, cool :-) 
19:51 < maqui> how come you took it
19:51 -!- zcat is now known as zcat_dog
19:51 <@chrisc> i took about 400 that day...
19:51 <@vince_ox> so should we start only with london, oxford, sheffield, cambridge and leeds?
19:51 <@zcat_dog> off to walk the dog see you in 1/2 hour
19:51 <@vince_ox> ciao
19:51 < maqui> but that's the best one innit? i mean the people in it :)
19:52 <@chrisc> lol, of course!
19:52 < maqui> shadow
19:52 <@ionnek> vince - maybe state that in a mail to process.
19:52 <@andi_ldn> OK, read: to the london lot: nothing has been done on the london page - and let's not discuss that here but eldsewhere...
19:52 <@ionnek> ok, andi.
19:52 < maqui> agree
19:53 <@vince_ox> but are you ready for a launch next week? (london)
19:53 < maqui> not as london
19:53 < maqui> just to explain quickly...
19:53 < maqui> london list has 60 people in it ... lurking silently
19:54 <@vince_ox> ok...
19:54 < maqui> we want to call them for a general meeting in two weeks and tell them
19:54 <@ionnek> question again - are we (london) ready for the entire site to go live next week, even if london is not ready?
19:54 -!- ana2 [~chatzilla at 81.2.110.152] has joined #uk
19:54 < maqui> the site is ready and see what happens with imc-london
19:54 -!- mode/#uk [+o maqui] by ChanServ
19:54 <@maqui> yep we are ready for the entire site!
19:54 -!- mode/#uk [+o ana2] by ChanServ
19:54 <@ionnek> ok. 
19:54 <@vince_ox> i think we can go live without london
19:54 <@maqui> yess me too
19:54 <@vince_ox> so then oxford, sheffield, leeds and cambridge
19:54 <@andi_ldn> i'd say of course we're ready we just copy oxford and make it pink ;)
19:55 <@ana_ldn> agree with andi ... lol
19:55 <@ionnek> agreee with vince. oxford, sheffield, leeds and cambridge
19:55 <@vince_ox> what about scotland?
19:55 <@andi_ldn> i don't want mir go live without london
19:55 <@vince_ox> is anarchobabe here?
19:55 <@ionnek> i think she's fidra_away.
19:55 <@maqui> andi why not
19:55 <@chrisc> they are logging but have gone out i think
19:55 <@andi_ldn> she mailed saying she'll log but ain't present...
19:55 <@ana_ldn> andi - whay not?
19:56 <@maqui> whay:))
19:56 <@andi_ldn> whooey:)
19:56 <@chrisc> london can be fixed in a few hours with a quick hack :-)
19:56 <@vince_ox> andi_ldn: i think we can go out without london and add it two weeks after for example
19:56 <@maqui> andi why not go live without lnd
19:56 <@vince_ox> we can also fix it very fast
19:56 <@vince_ox> two minutes to copy the templates and an hour to cutomize the stylesheet
19:56 <@andi_ldn> coz i think it'd be a shame...
19:56 <@andi_ldn> there's lotta ldn content on de preparation page
19:56 <@ana_ldn> i think it'd be good for decentralisation, actually
19:56 <@maqui> yep man but imc-london is nothing yet
19:56 <@chrisc> then we fix london and do them all :-)
19:56 <@ionnek> i think it would be quite funny!
19:57 <@maqui> only the same old people
19:57 <@ana_ldn> marion agrees with me
19:57 <@andi_ldn> sorry we are 15 pple in london and the fact that there's 60 lurkers on the london list is not ouir problem...
19:57  * ionnek too
19:57 <@vince_ox> personnaly if there's no imc-london collective now there shouldn't be a imc-london section... :-)
19:58 <@chrisc> between leeds and sheff we probably have 60 lurkers already (well not quite...)
19:58 <@ionnek> hi hi - we'll all be jobless!
19:58 <@ana_ldn> yes let's block a london section!!
19:58 <@chrisc> lol
19:58 <@ana_ldn> lol
19:58 <@vince_ox> :-)
19:58 <@andi_ldn> ;)
19:59 <@vince_ox> no but seriously do you think london should be included? technically it's not a problem
19:59 <@ana_ldn> so - consensus that uk site goes mir in about a week?
19:59 <@vince_ox> ana_ldn: agree
19:59 <@chrisc> ana_ldn: ok
19:59 <@ana_ldn> others?
19:59 <@ionnek> maybe the weekend after the coming. 
19:59 <@andi_ldn> hrm... only when the publish page bug is fixed!
19:59 <@vince_ox> andi_ldn: just have to ask zapata... you read my email?
20:00 <@maqui> i say ok to go live a.s.a.p but london lot needs to talk about it still
20:00 <@andi_ldn> yep. will ask him tmrw coz tonite we'll do irc...
20:00 <@vince_ox> andi_ldn: indeed... :-)
20:00 <@chrisc> dns is the last switch to be flicked in a switch over, we can do everything upto that ...
20:00 <@ana_ldn> consensus: uk goes mir as soon as a bug in the publish page is fixed
20:00 <@ionnek> not before wekend after next, ok?
20:00 <@vince_ox> ana_ldn: agree
20:00 <@vince_ox> ionnek: why
20:00 <@andi_ldn> i say lets aim for sat in 10 days:)
20:01 <@ionnek> vince - ok?
20:01 <@andi_ldn> we can always switch indymedia.org.uk but we NEED sysadmin to do uk.indymedia.org
20:01 <@vince_ox> yes, well i don't know ok with what... :-)
20:01 <@vince_ox> but i agree... :-)
20:02 <@andi_ldn> so that has to be OK'd wif de global dns'ers
20:02 <@maqui> you can always do a feature bout how slow is londonimc:)
20:02 <@ana_ldn> 0k - 10 days at one... 10 days at two...
20:02 <@andi_ldn> if we all consens on a date then we just demand them to be switchin i think...
20:02 <@vince_ox> actually
20:02 <@andi_ldn> and three
20:02 <@vince_ox> i won't be there in ten days
20:02 <@andi_ldn> aaaaiiiii
20:03 <@vince_ox> I'm leaving the thursday before... i'll miss the launch... :-):-)
20:03 <@vince_ox> doesn'T matter
20:03 <@andi_ldn> how long will u be gone?
20:03 <@vince_ox> leving thursday night and coming back after evian
20:03 -!- ionnek is now known as ionnek_phone
20:03 <@ana_ldn> just make sure you don't miss the launch party
20:04  * chrisc remembers we did promise a evian rss feed 
20:04 <@vince_ox> couldn't we try to launch before thursday... so that i can show everything to other people in oxford...
20:04 <@ionnek_phone> dave_london just called, lots of apologies, locked himself out his house and cant access computer. waiting for locksmith now...
20:04 <@maqui> ha!
20:05 -!- ionnek_phone is now known as ionnek
20:06 <@ionnek> maybe lets drop the question on launch date now and come back to it later?
20:06 <@maqui> so what about launch date then?
20:06 <@andi_ldn>  vince_ox: before thursday... hrm... can we try to think what needs to be agreed first
20:06 <@vince_ox> can't we say that we launch as soon as the publish page is fixed?
20:06 <@vince_ox> ionnek: agree
20:06 <@andi_ldn> what about the features feed
20:06 <@ana_ldn> just realised, we need to decide what needs to be done
20:06 <@ana_ldn> like a feature in front page announcing it
20:06 <@andi_ldn> what about the other regions
20:06 <@ana_ldn> who's gonna write it
20:06 <@andi_ldn> what about the types to start with
20:06 <@vince_ox> ok let's go on with the second question in the agenda?
20:07 <@ionnek> Q: Which open publishing (OP) system do we implement on the uk startpage?
20:07 <@andi_ldn> what about to not/or yes to a wastebasket?
20:07 <@ana_ldn> i think ionnek's question comes first...
20:07 <@ionnek> hang on - first generally - moderation b4 or afterwards?
20:07 <@vince_ox> oxford, sheffield and london propose moderation b4
20:07 <@ana_ldn> london: we go for afterwards
20:08 <@vince_ox> and only cambridge and leeds will be part of the launch
20:08 <@vince_ox> afterwards sorry
20:08 <@ana_ldn> well we love the before model, but we realise we don't have 
20:08 <@ana_ldn> enough people for it
20:08 <@ana_ldn> plus - there is a legal question
20:08 <@ana_ldn> bal?
20:08 <@vince_ox> so the only question is to know what cambridge and leeds think of that
20:08 <@vince_ox> for the launch
20:08 <@chrisc> leeds have a meeting next week
20:08 <@ionnek> lets ask them on email.
20:09  * ana_ldn need to say sth
20:09 <@ana_ldn> about the convenience of uk model
20:09 <@ana_ldn> peopel are too used to the immediacy
20:09 <@ana_ldn> and if we go for a german model
20:09 <@ana_ldn> that takes time for postings to be published
20:09 <@ana_ldn> peopel will start to publish twice
20:09 <@ana_ldn> thinking it didn't work
20:10  * ana_ldn finished
20:10 <@chrisc> good point
20:10 <@vince_ox> yup
20:10 <@ana_ldn> it was zcat's point
20:10 <@ionnek> bal - the legal point?
20:10 <@ana_ldn> it's a question of authorship
20:11 <@ana_ldn> if people publish and we hide it,
20:11 <@ana_ldn> they are the authors
20:11 <@ana_ldn> if we hide it and then publish,
20:11 <@ana_ldn> legally we are 'more' responsible
20:11 <@ana_ldn> we are authors in a way
20:11  * vince_ox wants to say something
20:11 <@ana_ldn> shame that bal is away, she'd explain better
20:11 <@ana_ldn> en
20:11 <@ana_ldn> end
20:11 <@ana_ldn> vince?
20:11 <@vince_ox> i think the people that were opposed were mainly from scotland
20:12 <@vince_ox> and they aren'T there now
20:12 <@andi_ldn> but
20:12 <@vince_ox> so i think it would be important to decide what do we do wit hscotland for the launch, i.e.
20:12 <@vince_ox> do they want to be fully part of it now
20:12 <@vince_ox> or they prefer to wait or whatever
20:12  * vince_ox finish
20:12 <@andi_ldn> scottish 'go ahead' mail
20:12 <@andi_ldn> http://www.email-lists.org/pipermail/imc-uk-emergency/2003-May/000101.html
20:12 <@andi_ldn> andi <end>
20:12 <@vince_ox> yey but do they want to be part of mir as a subsection
20:12 <@vince_ox> or they only want to be linked to their actual site
20:13 <@vince_ox> but we can'T answer this now... <end>
20:13 <@ionnek> if we send a summary about this chat to process, we can ask all these questions. 
20:13 <@ionnek> and include in our summary that the discussion should be ongoing.
20:13 -!- maqui changed the topic of #uk to: http://www.email-lists.org/pipermail/imc-uk-emergency/2003-May/000126.html
20:14 <@maqui> sorry ... didn't mean to do that :-0
20:14 <@vince_ox> so for now we agree that we start with moderation b4, right?
20:14 <@andi_ldn> after...
20:14 <@vince_ox> afterwards sorry
20:14 <@vince_ox> so confused.... :-)
20:14 <@ionnek> vince andi or chris - you know the tech stuff best , can you send the questions to scotland-discussion?
20:14 <@andi_ldn> :)
20:14 <@vince_ox> german and dutch was mcuh easier... :-)
20:14  * chrisc i'm not on that list...
20:15 <@andi_ldn> hrm - i am
20:15 <@ionnek> it's an open list.
20:15 <@vince_ox> hahah so you send it :-)
20:15 <@andi_ldn> i'll dothat then...
20:15 <@vince_ox> ;-)
20:15 <@andi_ldn> so hang on all:
20:15 -!- bal [~jirc at 80.225.24.39] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
20:16 <@andi_ldn> i mail to scotland that cambridge oxford london leeds and?
20:16 <@andi_ldn> will go for moderation afterwards
20:16 <@vince_ox> sheffield
20:16 <@vince_ox> (well we don't know for cambridge and leeds)
20:16 <@andi_ldn> (ehm. sorry)
20:16 <@chrisc> yes?
20:16 <@ionnek> slight complication - I don't want to put pressure on that emerging collective, at the same time we need to know what their preferences are.
20:17 <@ana_ldn> i would go for a traditional procedure
20:17 <@andi_ldn> ok we ask scotland if they want to join in now or if they prefer to wait?
20:17 <@ana_ldn> formal propsal in process, maybe in cambridge and leeds lists too
20:17 <@vince_ox> i think we should say that we start with this system *only* for technical reasons ( not enough people to maintain a moderation b4) and that it can change later
20:17 <@ana_ldn> and if no objections...
20:17 <@ana_ldn> vince: agree
20:17 <@ionnek> ana, vince - good ideas
20:17 <@ana_ldn> another thing - 
20:17 <@vince_ox> and we take a real decision at the next face-to-face meeting, that's it
20:18 -!- andi_ldn is now known as andi_fone
20:18 <@ana_ldn> that meeting would be an evaluation meeting
20:18 <@ana_ldn> where we evaluate how it went and if we need to change
20:18 <@vince_ox> ana_ldn: agree
20:18 <@ana_ldn> based on the experience we got in the first - 2 months?
20:19 <@vince_ox> chris suggested the end of july i think
20:19 <@ionnek> finished with discussing op model?
20:19 <@vince_ox> yup for me
20:19 <@ana_ldn> yes
20:19 <@vince_ox> Q: Do we want an extra "regional page" for features from "other regions"?
20:20 <@ionnek> chris I think didn't want it.
20:20 <@ionnek> ?
20:20 <@chrisc> ?
20:20 <@ana_ldn> andi's question was - 
20:20 <@ana_ldn> what about a waste basket
20:21 <@ionnek> andi is away now, lets do that later.
20:21 <@ionnek> Q: Do we want an extra "regional page" for features from "other regions"?
20:21 <@vince_ox> i think the underlying question is "who will maintain it and how?"
20:21 <@maqui> well there was a mail from exeter about this
20:21 <@chrisc> i don't think 'other regions' is a region from a metadata point of view, that's all really
20:22 <@vince_ox> i do agree with chris but as was said i wasn'T at the meeting at lancaster and a decision was taken there, so maybe we should respect it
20:22 <@maqui> exeter wants it but i personally dont see the need for it
20:22 <@ana_ldn> i do
20:22 <@maqui> yes but problem is -
20:22 <@maqui> whos gonna maintain that section
20:22 <@maqui> what collective/people?
20:22 <@chrisc> http://www.email-lists.org/pipermail/imc-uk-emergency/2003-May/000123.html
20:22 <@ana_ldn> features list in a rota basis
20:23 <@maqui> i dont think it will work
20:23 <@maqui> everyone will focuss either on teir section or the startpage
20:23 <@chrisc> imc-westcountry?
20:23 <@maqui> it could easyly become a dumping ground for homeless news
20:23 <@vince_ox> i think that's the idea
20:23 <@vince_ox> if people don't have a sectino, then they create one, as westcountry is doing now
20:24 <@chrisc> i agree
20:24 <@ana_ldn> not every one has the strength
20:24 <@maqui> but a section should be maintained with a collective behind
20:24 <@maqui> so whay about places that only have one people involved?
20:24 <@ana_ldn> i think the rota basis worked - at least for a while
20:24 <@maqui> like exeter seems to be now
20:24 -!- andi_fone is now known as andi
20:25 <@maqui> but couldn't "other regions" use and get involved with the nearest section/collective that exist
20:25 <@ionnek> idea: at the mo, "other regions" go to frontpage. like fairford. the uk feats list is dealing with them.  continue doing that?
20:25 <@ana_ldn> uk feats could continue doing that
20:25 <@chrisc> in sheffield it was just 3 of us to start when i requested the imc-sheffield list...
20:25 <@ana_ldn> only with the feats going to a click away
20:26 <@ana_ldn> like the local regions
20:26 <@ana_ldn> instead of directly to front page
20:26 <@vince_ox> but people who are doing uk feats will have to do local feats now...
20:27 <@maqui> sorry but i just cant see that section coz...
20:27 <@ana_ldn> not every one who are actively involved in uk feats are attached to a collective
20:27 <@ana_ldn> (sorry maqui)
20:27 <@maqui> i imagine an othr regions middle colums with unconnected stuff in it
20:27 <@maqui> a feature from exeter
20:27 <@vince_ox> ana_ldn: ok, didn' know...
20:27 <@maqui> another from aberdeen
20:27 <@maqui> andother from isle of man ... whatever
20:27 <@ana_ldn> maqui: so what?
20:27 <@maqui> what's the connection ... their homelesness??
20:27 <@ana_ldn> it's an 'other regions' region, innit
20:28 <@ana_ldn> no: that htey are covering regions not covered by collectives
20:28 <@maqui> not another region it not a region
20:28 <@ana_ldn> but hang on
20:28  * ana_ldn talking
20:28 <@ana_ldn> in most questionaires
20:28 <@ana_ldn> you have, for instance...
20:28 <@ana_ldn> please state your race background
20:28 <@ana_ldn> and it says, white, black.... others
20:28  * ana_ldn end
20:29 <@maqui> and soooo
20:29  * vince_ox my turn! :-)
20:29 <@vince_ox> I personnaly think that if some people want to
20:29 <@vince_ox> maintain this section
20:29 <@vince_ox> then let's do it
20:29 <@ionnek> proposal: we ask exeter and pp who feel strongly about "other regions" if someone volunteers to maintin the page, if yes we make one?
20:29  * andi raises a hand
20:29 <@maqui> ionnek: agree
20:30 <@vince_ox> ionnek: agree
20:30 <@ionnek> andi go on
20:30 <@andi>  i find it problematic to just overrule sth which was decided in lanc
20:30 <@maqui> can i say?...
20:30 <@andi> specially as sara now has made clear that she wants the other regions as mailed on
20:30 <@andi> http://www.email-lists.org/pipermail/imc-uk-emergency/2003-May/000109.html
20:31 <@andi> no maqui wait plesase
20:31 <@andi> i agree with the proposal but it shldn't just be put to sara...
20:31 <@andi> if we want to change sth what was decided in lanc we have to come up wif reasons to change it
20:31 <@andi> <end>
20:32 <@maqui> i dont think we decided it in lancs
20:32 <@maqui> we jsut talked about it as noone knew exactly what we were talking about
20:32  * ana_ldn reading the email
20:32 <@ionnek> proposal: in lancester we decided to have an other regions section. Question is now - who volunteers to maintain it? 
20:33 <@maqui> now things are taking shape and become clearer than in lan
20:33 <@vince_ox> proposal: should we ask on the list who would like to maintain it, and if there are enough people then we create it
20:33 <@maqui> as for sara's mail i responded to her (dont know how to get that mail here so fast)
20:33 <@maqui> and i think my response is as valid as her mail
20:34  * chrisc use emg list for fast mail
20:34 <@maqui> vince_ox: agree but i wuld stress that ONLY if there's people willing to maintain it
20:34 <@maqui> vince_ox: agree but stress
20:35 -!- mode/#uk [-p] by maqui
20:35 <@vince_ox> maqui: i think that's a prerequisite anyway, there couldn't be and other region section if no one wants to maintain it
20:35 <@maqui> tryiin to speak but not appearing here!??
20:35 <@ionnek> we don't need to decide this now. An exchange on email is already happening. Now we need to check if there are volunteers to maintain it, or if the uk feats list takes on the job, or find another solution. 
20:35  * andi asks can we please use hands today? that'll b less chaotic...
20:35  * vince_ox me
20:35 <@maqui> mmmmmm
20:36  * andi : type "/me raises hand"
20:36  * vince_ox raises hand
20:36 <@andi> vince~?
20:36 <@vince_ox> so is the proposal of sending an email ok for all of us?
20:36 <@maqui> helloooooo
20:36 <@andi> maqui raise a hand.
20:36 <@vince_ox> if enough people reply, we create it, if not, too bad for the luaunch
20:36 <@vince_ox> <end>
20:36  * andi enforces himself as facilitator now...
20:36 <@ionnek> tha
20:37 <@andi> hands? type "/me raises hand"
20:37  * ana_ldn raises
20:37 <@andi> ana?
20:37 <@ana_ldn> i agree
20:37 <@ana_ldn> but i'd say that sara would be willing, and me to <end>
20:38 <@maqui> just trying this "/me raises habd"
20:38 <@maqui> "/me raises hand"
20:38  * maqui 
20:38 <@maqui> ahhh i see now ... sorry
20:38 <@maqui> ok agree on that ONLY if enough peole to maintain it
20:39 <@maqui> if not 2 baaad
20:39  * ana_ldn raises hand
20:39  * andi : maqui ure finished? type <end> if yes
20:39 <@maqui> <end> sorry
20:39 <@andi> ana?
20:40 <@ana_ldn> would we need a new features list
20:40 <@ana_ldn> for that other regions, then?
20:40 <@ana_ldn> or would we just use the existing one?
20:40 <@ionnek> start with existing one, split if necessary?
20:40 <@ana_ldn> how would we evaluate that there are 'enough people'
20:40 <@ana_ldn> ,end,
20:40 <@ionnek> you plus two?
20:41 <@ana_ldn> what is the minimum number?
20:41  * andi : ionnek is that a hand?
20:41 <@ionnek> (end)
20:41  * andi raises hand
20:41 <@andi> hehe...
20:42 <@andi> i think we can easily use the feat list and ask each startin collective to commit a week to features list...
20:42 <@andi> end
20:42 <@vince_ox> * raises hand
20:42  * vince_ox raises hand sorry
20:42 <@andi> vince
20:42  * ana_ldn waves hands in agreement
20:42 <@vince_ox> I don't think we should *ask* the local collectives,
20:42 <@vince_ox> only the volunteers should do it
20:42 <@vince_ox> cause it's already alot of work to start a new local indymedia
20:42 <@vince_ox> withouth being involved in a "other reiongs" one
20:43 <@vince_ox> <end>
20:43  * maqui raises hand
20:43 <@andi> maq
20:43  * ionnek raises hand
20:43 <@maqui> i cant believe we saying all this about nes feats list etc...
20:43 <@maqui> we just agreed that effectivelly other regions dont exist yet
20:43  * ana_ldn raises hand
20:44 <@maqui> it's NOT EXISTENT until there's a collective (people) that wants to deal with it
20:44 <@maqui> si question here and now is
20:44  * vince_ox agrees
20:44 <@maqui> where will the news from "other regions" go until "other regions" page exist
20:44 <@maqui> <end>
20:44 <@andi> ionnek then ana
20:44 <@ionnek> italy gives a regional topic page to groups only if they've been involved in imc italy for a little while and have familiarised themselves with the admin and process. 
20:45 <@ionnek> b t way, I don't think we've  decided on no other regions. 
20:45 <@ionnek> well maybe to propose to process that we start with no other regions, and set it up when there are volunteers?
20:45 <@ionnek> (end)
20:45 <@ana_ldn> me?
20:45  * vince_ox agrees
20:46  * andi yep ana
20:46 <@ana_ldn> maqui and ionnek - it was actually decided in lancs
20:46 <@ana_ldn> it was proposed in the wish list group,
20:46  * maqui 
20:46 <@ana_ldn> then to hte main group, and no objections were
20:46 <@ana_ldn> maqui: i understand that if there is a page
20:46 <@ana_ldn> it also needs a template
20:47 <@ana_ldn> like the one london hasn't got yet
20:47 <@ana_ldn> so i do see that we do need a group that takes care of these things...
20:47  * vince_ox technical point: the template is not a problem
20:47 <@ana_ldn> and i'm in no technical position to do it
20:47 <@ana_ldn> ok vince
20:47 <@ana_ldn> political question is, then
20:47  * andi : maqui then vince(was thata hand?
20:48 <@andi> sorry ana go on
20:48 <@vince_ox> no
20:48 <@vince_ox> :-)
20:48 <@maqui> yep
20:48 <@ana_ldn> eeehhh
20:48 <@ana_ldn> political question
20:48 <@ana_ldn> do the people who have been more involved
20:48 <@ana_ldn> really not want to help out
20:48  * andi : still ana then maqui
20:48 <@ana_ldn> setting up these other regions page
20:48 <@ana_ldn> so that people with no region - like sara
20:49 <@ana_ldn> can have a page
20:49 <@ana_ldn> end
20:49  * andi : maqui
20:49 <@maqui> ok as i said before what was talked in lancs i don't think were 'decission" but...
20:49 <@maqui> following what u just said
20:50 <@maqui> its not a matter of not wanting to help but rather wwanting to help whom
20:50 <@maqui> who should we help then?
20:50 <@maqui> now when talking about thse things
20:50  * vince_ox raises hand
20:50 <@maqui> i normally try to take the view of the visitor to the site
20:51 <@maqui> people not involved in day-to-day imcing
20:51 <@maqui> i see this people going to an "othe regions" page that makes no sense at all
20:51 <@maqui> an unconnected list of stuff
20:51 <@maqui> only connected because there's no other place for them to publixh
20:52 <@maqui> and i think this is very patronising for people in "other regions"
20:52 <@maqui> <enc>
20:52  * andi : vince
20:52 <@vince_ox> two points: 1.
20:52 <@vince_ox> it's not that people wouldn't want to help, but for example I
20:52 <@vince_ox> don't think i would have time for that because it will be
20:52 <@vince_ox> quite hard to start the oxford collective
20:52 <@vince_ox> and the uk site will need work also
20:52 <@vince_ox> 2. should we discuss what needs to be done now
20:52  * ana_ldn raises hand
20:52 <@vince_ox> and continue this discussion after, cause i have to leave in 15 minutes
20:53 <@vince_ox> <end>
20:53  * andi : ana
20:53 <@ana_ldn> just had a private conversation
20:53 <@ana_ldn> 1. maybe this is just a theroretical question
20:53 <@ana_ldn> that can be left for the evaluation
20:54 <@ana_ldn> but - 2.
20:54 <@ana_ldn> from hte users point of view
20:54 <@ana_ldn> if i'm a user from 'no regions'
20:54 <@ana_ldn> and want to look at 'only' my local stuff
20:54 <@ana_ldn> if there is no 'other regions' section
20:54 <@ana_ldn> i have to look at ALL uk postings
20:54  * maqui raises hand
20:54 <@ana_ldn> to see my stuff
20:55 <@ana_ldn> if there is a 'other regions' link
20:55 <@ana_ldn> i just click on it
20:55 <@ana_ldn> end
20:55  * andi adapts vince's proposal: "should we discuss what needs to be done now" whaddya say?
20:55 <@maqui> ok then
20:55 <@andi> sorry makki we go in circles i think
20:55  * ionnek raises hands
20:55  * ana_ldn agrees
20:55 <@andi> ionnek?
20:55 <@ionnek> wanna ask vince what he wants to discuss now pls
20:55 <@andi> vince?
20:56 <@vince_ox> well i think we should just fix what has to be done before the launch
20:56 <@vince_ox> then i let you have these discussions after i leave
20:56  * ionnek asks what does vince think needs doing?
20:56 <@vince_ox> well, technically, the publish page
20:57 <@andi> fukk
20:57 -!- andi is now known as andiwrk
20:57 <@ana_ldn> lol
20:57 <@andiwrk> anyone facilitate?
20:57 <@ionnek> yeah if necessary I will
20:57 <@vince_ox> good
20:57 <@maqui> who knows how to moderate whilst andys away?
20:57 <@maqui> ok ionnek
20:57 <@ionnek> vince go on
20:57 <@vince_ox> ok so publish page, RSS feeds, urls
20:58 <@vince_ox> that's what technically i think is necessary
20:58 <@vince_ox> anything else chris?
20:58  * maqui dont understand RSS
20:58 <@vince_ox> ask chris... :-)
20:58 <@vince_ox> he is the man
20:58  * ana_ldn asks can we help with that or is it a techi thing
20:58  * ionnek asks chris to explain
20:59 <@vince_ox> i think chris is away...
20:59 <@maqui> ov vince u explain?
20:59 <@vince_ox> well i think it's just techie things anyway, don't know much about RSS and urls
20:59 <@vince_ox> the other thing
20:59 <@vince_ox> would be to fix a list of topics (which was sort of done last time)
20:59 <@vince_ox> with definitions
21:00 <@vince_ox> and also to decide if you agree with the "actions" section
21:00  * ana_ldn raises
21:00 <@vince_ox> and the uk features thing
21:00 <@vince_ox> <end>
21:00 <@ionnek> proposal - forget about rss for now. 
21:00 <@maqui> k
21:01 <@vince_ox> ana?
21:01 <@ana_ldn> needs done: an announcement in front page
21:01 <@ana_ldn> prominent and from now until the lounch
21:01  * vince_ox raises hand
21:01 <@ionnek> vince
21:01 <@vince_ox> can we decide who is doing what? anyone wants to write definitions for the topics to start with?
21:01 <@vince_ox> anyone wants to write the announcement?
21:02 <@ionnek> what do you mean by definitions for topc
21:02 <@maqui> that can be done on features list
21:02 <@vince_ox> and also, what about the world section?
21:02 <@vince_ox> <end>
21:02  * ana_ldn raises
21:02  * ionnek has written proposal for feature on feats list
21:02  * maqui raises
21:02 <@ionnek> ana
21:02 <@ana_ldn> andi wrote a list of definitions for last meeting
21:03  * vince_ox proposal
21:03 <@ana_ldn> and he's done another on email,  so that's done
21:03 <@ana_ldn> end
21:03 <@ionnek> vince
21:03 <@vince_ox> well maqui before...
21:03 <@ionnek> oh maquis?
21:03 <@maqui> ta
21:03 <@maqui> feature is done in list
21:04 <@maqui> lit of definitions
21:04 <@maqui> too
21:04  * ana_ldn raises hand
21:04 <@maqui> lets listen vince proposal and then decide on worl page and action page
21:04 <@maqui> <enc>
21:04 <@vince_ox> proposal:
21:04 <@vince_ox> 1. we put the announcement feature online tonight on the uk site
21:04 <@vince_ox> 2. we take Andi's definitions for the start
21:05 <@vince_ox> 3. we keep the actions section as it is for the launch
21:05  * ionnek raises
21:05 <@ionnek> ana
21:05 <@vince_ox> 4. we put the world section in the topics section since it doesn't need anything special (it is just a topic)
21:05 <@vince_ox> haven'T finished! :-)
21:05 <@ana_ldn> go on
21:05 <@vince_ox> so it is just a topic that people can choose
21:05 <@vince_ox> then everything would be read y for the launch <end><
21:06 <@ionnek> sorry folks.
21:06 <@ionnek> Ik'm confused and can't deal with this handsup facilitation. 
21:06 <@ionnek> ana or someone - vounteer?
21:06 <@ana_ldn> i'll take over, we'll see
21:06 <@ana_ldn> my turn: feature online:
21:07 <@ana_ldn> has to done in a way that it stays there
21:07 <@ana_ldn> until, say 2 days before the launch
21:07 <@ana_ldn> then i'd change it to a 'more urgent' announcement
21:07 <@ana_ldn> saying on what date it's going to be 'switched'
21:07 <@ana_ldn> and with clear intructions on how to publish with the new system
21:08  * maqui raises
21:08 <@ana_ldn> i'm not sure about the world 'topic'
21:08 <@ana_ldn> end
21:08 <@ana_ldn> ionnek?
21:08  * ana_ldn am facilitating
21:08 <@ana_ldn> sorry - maqui?
21:09  * vince_ox process point
21:09 <@ana_ldn> go on vince
21:09 <@vince_ox> i gotta go now, have an Evian meeting
21:09 <@vince_ox> but I'll be back later and maybe work on the mir site tonight
21:09 <@ana_ldn> thanks
21:09 <@vince_ox> so I'll read your proposals and implement them if possible! :-)
21:09 <@vince_ox> ciao :-)
21:09  * ionnek raises
21:09 <@ana_ldn> bye!! see you later
21:09 <@ana_ldn> maqui
21:10 <@ana_ldn> then ionnek
21:10 <@ana_ldn> maqui?
21:10 <@ana_ldn> (ionnek, quick if maqui doesn't type)
21:10 <@ionnek> feature proposal for launch here http://lists.indymedia.org/mailman/public/imc-uk-features/2003-May/003802.html
21:11 -!- andiwrk is now known as andi_back_reading
21:11 <@ana_ldn> MAQUI?
21:11  * ana_ldn raises hand
21:11  * ana_ldn seems he's away
21:12 <@ana_ldn> me: but this feature reads as any other feature
21:12 -!- Maqu1 [shadowirc at 62.255.72.179] has joined #uk
21:12 <@ana_ldn> it either is done by techies so that it stays
21:12 <@ana_ldn> (maqui you speak after me)
21:12  * andi_back_reading raises hand
21:12 <@ana_ldn> or every new feature is put under it
21:12 -!- andi_back_reading is now known as andi
21:12 <@ana_ldn> every one agrees?
21:12 <@ana_ldn> end
21:12 < Maqu1> sorry my connection terminated and been away for some minutes trying to reconnect so dunno whats the story now
21:13 < Maqu1> pass my hand
21:13 <@ana_ldn> maqui was first before he got cicked out - no just say what you wanted to say
21:13 <@ana_ldn> maqui?
21:13 < Maqu1> forget it
21:13 <@ana_ldn> andi
21:13 <@ana_ldn> andi_back
21:13 <@andi> oke
21:14 <@andi> vinces points/proposal loox good to me but for two clarifications:
21:14 <@andi> 1. we put the announcement feature online tonight on the uk site
21:14 <@andi> 2. we don't take my definitions for the start but do the minimum:
21:14 <@andi>    Newswire
21:14 <@andi>    UK Feature
21:14 <@andi>    Regional Feature
21:14 <@andi>    Startpage-special (sticky on top)
21:14 <@andi> 3. we keep the actions section as it is for the launch
21:14 <@andi> 4. we put the world section in the THEMATIC topics section rather
21:14 <@andi>    than in the REGIONAL topics  (is that what u mean vince?)
21:14 <@andi> meaning:
21:14 <@andi> where does world go?
21:14  * ana_ldn has a question
21:14 <@andi> and : is evrybody happy with getting rid of trash?
21:14 <@andi> end
21:15 <@ana_ldn> what is teh start page special?
21:15 <@andi> thats the sticky topic
21:15  * ionnek raises hand
21:15 <@ana_ldn> ionnek
21:15 <@ionnek> what definitions are you talking about?
21:15 <@ionnek> end
21:16 <@andi> if u look at the test page it's
21:16 <@andi> "New Fox reality show to determine ruler of Iraq"
21:16 <@andi> http://uktest.indymedia.de/en/
21:16 <@andi> different layout
21:16 <@andi> always sytays on top
21:16 <@andi> end
21:16  * ana_ldn raises hand - he he
21:16 <@ana_ldn> can i propose that instructions on how to publish 
21:16  * chrisc sry been away...
21:17 <@ana_ldn> stay in that sticky for the first 2 weeks or so after the launch or is it out of place?
21:17 <@ana_ldn> end
21:17  * chrisc raises hand
21:17 <@ana_ldn> chris
21:17 <@chrisc> what does 'getting rid of trash' mean?
21:17 <@chrisc> </end>
21:18 <@ana_ldn> sorry - can we sort out this proposal before we move on please
21:18 <@ana_ldn> can we agree on andi's proposal?
21:18 < Maqu1> ok by me but one thing
21:18 < Maqu1> yes?
21:18  * andi wants to say what "getting rid of trash" means
21:18  * ionnek dont understand. do you mean by definitions the article types on the admin page?
21:19 <@ana_ldn> maqui if want to say more if not, andi
21:19 <@ana_ldn> maqui?
21:19 < Maqu1> andi
21:19 <@ana_ldn> finished?
21:19 <@ana_ldn> andi
21:19 <@andi> oke
21:19 <@andi> what vince says above as definitions means article types
21:20 <@andi> i think we should NOT have trash as articletype coz switzerland had massive probs wif it
21:20 <@andi> so that setup without trash would mean it's nearly what we have now on uk
21:20 <@andi> end
21:20  * chrisc raises hand
21:21 <@ana_ldn> chris
21:21 <@chrisc> so what happens to stuff when it is hidden? and how is it hidden?
21:21 -!- nina [~h at 62.31.109.108] has joined #uk
21:21 <@chrisc> </end>
21:21  * ana_ldn has the same question
21:21  * andi raises hand
21:21 <@ana_ldn> andi
21:22 <@andi> the stuff being hidden would appear in waht is called in nl the "open content"
21:22 <@andi> basically it's our present uk-admin page
21:22 <@andi> and i would like to link that not one but two clicks away
21:23 <@andi> with editorial guidelines inbetween as now on uk
21:23 <@andi> end
21:23  * chrisc raises hand
21:23 <@ana_ldn> chris
21:23 <@chrisc> fine about the two clicks to start with
21:23  * ana_ldn agrees with two clicks away
21:23 <@chrisc> how will it work though?
21:24 <@ana_ldn> andi
21:24 <@chrisc> using a topic rather than a type?
21:24 <@chrisc> </end>
21:24 <@ana_ldn> (sorry) - now andi?
21:24  * andi raises hand
21:24 <@andi> yeah?
21:24 <@ana_ldn> andi!
21:24 <@andi> ok
21:24 <@andi> it's nothing to do with topic or type - we just use the dutch code for "open content"
21:25 <@andi> we could even make it more like a list to make it look like the current uk admin page
21:25 <@andi> that'd give as well some coninuity
21:25 <@andi> it wouldn't have the tickboxes tho as now
21:25 <@andi> end
21:25  * ana_ldn raises hand
21:26 <@ana_ldn> me: do we need to discuss these practicalities or... i'd like to see the discussion going towards decisions
21:26 <@ana_ldn> end
21:26  * chrisc raises hand
21:26 <@ana_ldn> chirs
21:27 <@chrisc> yeah that would be fine something like the trash bin here:
21:27 <@chrisc> http://nl.indymedia.org/
21:27 -!- maqui [shadowirc at 62.255.205.73] has quit [Read error: Connection timed out]
21:27 <@chrisc> leading to:
21:27 <@chrisc> http://nl.indymedia.org/nl/opentrashbin.shtml
21:27 <@chrisc> is that what you mean?
21:27 <@chrisc> </end>
21:28  * ionnek raises
21:28  * ana_ldn currently reading
21:28 <@andi> ?me hand
21:28 <@ana_ldn> ionnek
21:28  * andi raises hand
21:28 <@ana_ldn> then andi - please don't wait for me to type andi again
21:28 <@ana_ldn> ionnek?
21:28 <@ionnek> dont think i like the dutch trash thing
21:28 <@ionnek> agree more with andi
21:28 <@ionnek> to have an "openposting" with EVERYTHING, not just the trash. and 2 clickes away. 
21:29 <@ionnek> end
21:29  * chrisc en version: http://nl.indymedia.org/en/opentrashbin.shtml
21:29 <@andi> oke just realised we still need a "Hidden" articletype for that so:
21:29 <@andi>    Newswire
21:29 <@andi>    UK Feature
21:29 <@andi>    Regional Feature
21:29 <@andi>    Startpage-special (sticky on top)
21:29 <@andi>     Hidden
21:29 <@andi> end
21:29  * ionnek raises hand again
21:29 <@ana_ldn> ionnek
21:30  * ana_ldn raises hand
21:30 <@ionnek> we discussed about the trash thing yesterday in london
21:30 <@ionnek> and it was felt that we need something between completely hidden and sort of half hidden. 
21:30 <@ionnek> as I understand, our present admin page is a sort o f  half hidden. 
21:31  * andi raises
21:31 <@ionnek> the dutch trash disappears after 5 days. 
21:31 <@ionnek> I'm confused about what to think but still like andis list of article types and the hidden a type. end
21:31 <@ana_ldn> me: 
21:31 <@ana_ldn> then andi
21:32 <@ana_ldn> i don't like the fact that they disappear completely after 5 days
21:32 <@ana_ldn> but i like the notice at teh top 'these articles are hidden for this and this (editorial guidelines)
21:33 <@ana_ldn> other wise, make every one read teh editorial guidelines
21:33 <@ana_ldn> before seeing the trashed postings
21:33  * Maqu1 raises
21:33 <@ana_ldn> end - andi
21:33 <@andi> i think the very idea of trash is dodgy
21:34 <@andi> ch indy got nearly done coz the accusation was that's a fascist collection attractive to neonazis
21:34 <@andi> i think an "openposting" with EVERYTHING dilutes the crap better
21:34 <@andi> end
21:34 <@ana_ldn> maqui
21:35 < Maqu1> i see the legal point
21:35  * ana_ldn raises hand
21:35 < Maqu1> but couldn't it be that the fact of completelly deleting postings would deter crap from appearing too
21:35 < Maqu1> <end>
21:36 <@ana_ldn> andi: yes so a trach where all crab is available is not cool - agree
21:36 <@ana_ldn> but we can still can have somewhere to click
21:36  * chrisc raises hand
21:36 <@ana_ldn> so that a certain posting goes hidden
21:37 <@ana_ldn> from the front page into the 'all posting, showing and hidden'
21:37 <@ana_ldn> instead of what we have now, having to click 2 or 3 times to hid sth
21:37 <@ana_ldn> end - chris
21:37 <@chrisc> is there a mir running the system andi is suggesting?
21:38 <@chrisc> portland has a compost pile
21:38 <@chrisc> http://portland.indymedia.org/en/compost/compost2003.shtml
21:38 <@chrisc> </end>
21:38  * ana_ldn has an answer...
21:38 <@ana_ldn> basque country have 'indymierda', meaning indy-shit
21:38 <@ana_ldn> i think they trash all crap there
21:39 <@ana_ldn> end
21:39  * chrisc wonders if ana has a web address to show this...
21:39 <@ana_ldn> no i haven't
21:40 <@ana_ldn> but portland is very graphic
21:40 <@ana_ldn> and i agree with andi it being a haven for fascists
21:40 <@ana_ldn> can we try a consensus
21:40 <@ana_ldn> ?
21:40 <@ana_ldn> end
21:40 <@ionnek> http://euskalherria.indymedia.org/eu/trashbin/trashbin.shtml
21:41  * ionnek confused.
21:41 <@ionnek> do we still need hands?
21:41 <@ana_ldn> why confused?
21:41 <@ana_ldn> no i don't we need any more, we are not enough
21:41 <@ionnek> too much waiting 4 tking
21:42 <@ionnek> andi ana marion don't want the dutch style trash i think. 
21:42  * nina agrees
21:42 <@ionnek> so we're 4!
21:42 <@zcat_dog> \nick zcat
21:43 <@ana_ldn> zcat back now, and nina is reading the logs, then will join in. she's from lancaster/scotland
21:43 -!- zcat_dog is now known as zcat
21:43 <@ionnek> put it to process summary?
21:44 <@ana_ldn> put what?
21:44  * nina says hello: hi everyone.
21:44 <@ionnek> hi
21:44 <@ana_ldn> o hi - did you read logs?
21:45 < nina> yes read them
21:45 <@ana_ldn> rest of you: can we put in summarty to process that we'd go for a trash model...
21:45 <@ionnek> 4 process summary: we go with andis article type definitions, and suggest to look for a technical solution to have an article type "open posting" which includes everything?
21:46 <@ionnek> or does this article type already exist? end
21:46 <@andi> it does
21:46 <@andi> its both Newswire and Hidden
21:46 <@andi> i'd have to ask zapata if it is possible to show in opencontent if an article is hidden or not
21:46 <@andi> otherwise it's just all.
21:46 <@andi> end
21:47 <@andi> (sorry didnt raise hand)
21:47 <@ana_ldn> that would be fine - just all
21:47 -!- mp [~jmp at 62.25.137.52] has joined #uk
21:47 <@ionnek> ok - you check it out, andi?
21:47 <@ana_ldn> may be let's go back to facilitating)
21:47 <@andi> y
21:48 <@ionnek> who - you andi?
21:48 <@andi> hrmmm... oke.
21:49 <@andi> if you want to talk you type "/me raises hand"
21:49 <@andi> if i do that this happens:
21:49  * andi raises hand
21:49 <@andi> oke?
21:49 <@ana_ldn> ok
21:49  * ana_ldn raises hand
21:49  * andi ana
21:49 <@ana_ldn> i have kind of taken the task to contact newly arrive people
21:50 < mp> (intro: hello ppl - just listening in, - martin from lancaster)
21:50 <@ana_ldn> and explain what we're doing, asking to introduce themselves
21:50 <@ana_ldn> and offering logs
21:50 <@ana_ldn> because ana2 can provide them :))
21:50 <@ana_ldn> end
21:50  * ionnek raises hands
21:51  * andi ionnek
21:51 <@ionnek> andi what about the world page?
21:51 <@andi> vince's proposal was:
21:51 <@andi> 4. we put the world section in the topics section
21:52 <@andi> question is:
21:52 <@andi> 4. we put the world section in the THEMATIC topics section rather
21:52 <@andi>    than in the REGIONAL topics  (is that what u mean vince?)
21:52 -!- ana_ldn [ana at 81.2.110.152] has quit [Excess Flood]
21:52 <@andi> at the mo its in regions
21:52 <@ionnek> vince has gone
21:52 <@andi> i know butt..
21:52  * Maqu1 raises
21:52  * andi : maqui
21:53 -!- ana_ldn [ana at 81.2.110.152] has joined #uk
21:53 <@ionnek> it is now in thematic topics because it shouldn't have anewswire.
21:53 < Maqu1> if its a static archive type page then goes to thematic
21:53 < Maqu1> now its on regional topics
21:53 < Maqu1> because we have not decided if it has newswire
21:54 < Maqu1> i favour world page as a archive of world news without newswire for now
21:54  * andi raise a hand
21:54 < Maqu1> and see if later the page develops into something more active
21:54 < Maqu1> <enc>
21:54 -!- ana_ldn [ana at 81.2.110.152] has quit [Excess Flood]
21:54  * zcat raises
21:55  * andi then zcat
21:55 <@andi> world is now in regional topics
21:55 <@zcat> sounds like a good idea
21:55 -!- ana_ldn [ana at 81.2.110.152] has joined #uk
21:55 <@andi> but that means it HAS a newswire...
21:55  * chrisc we could remove the newswire easily
21:55 <@zcat> i mean as archive page
21:56 <@zcat> no newswire
21:56 <@andi> zcat sorry i raised the hand first...
21:56 <@zcat> end
21:56 <@andi> oke me again?
21:56 <@zcat> sorry
21:56 <@andi> check world as it is now
21:56 <@andi> http://uktest.indymedia.de/en/region/world/
21:56 <@andi> it HAS a newswire...
21:56 <@andi> can we remove the wire chris>?
21:56 <@andi> end
21:56  * chrisc give me 5 mins and i'll remove it ...
21:57  * Maqu1 hand
21:57  * andi likes that
21:57 <@andi> maqui
21:57 < Maqu1> experience shows that world page its not active enough
21:57 < Maqu1> not enough people work on wrld news
21:58 < Maqu1> so why not do as most other imc's which is
21:58 < Maqu1> publish world news on front page and then archive them in a static world page without newswire
21:58 < Maqu1> end
21:58  * zcat hand
21:58 -!- nina [~h at 62.31.109.108] has quit [Read error: No route to host]
21:58  * andi : zcat
21:59 <@zcat> mmm i think thats a
21:59 <@zcat> good thing to go 4
21:59 <@zcat> and if more peeps wanna get 
21:59 <@zcat> involved then it can become more    ?
22:00 <@zcat> and go like it is now in active easilly enooug
22:00 <@zcat> end
22:00  * andi asks for hands...
22:01  * andi is then going for it himself :)
22:01 < Maqu1> ?me hand?
22:01 <@andi> so
22:01 <@andi> ah sorry maqui go on
22:01  * zcat hand
22:01 < Maqu1> well just an idea came up now
22:02 <@andi> ok maqui then zcat
22:02 -!- nina [~h at 62.31.97.118] has joined #uk
22:02 < Maqu1> as there's only one world news every 2 weeks or so
22:02 < Maqu1> then could we have a special "world news" box on front page which just shows the latest one
22:03 < Maqu1> when that needs changing with a new world feat
22:03 < Maqu1> then we archive the old one in the thematic topic "world page" page
22:03 < Maqu1> does it make any sense?
22:03 < Maqu1> end
22:04  * andi raises hand but zcat is befor him. go on zcat
22:04 <@zcat>  features 4 UK page been discussed?
22:04  * chrisc no newswire: http://uktest.indymedia.de/en/region/world/
22:04 <@zcat> as this is moving that way
22:04 <@zcat> propose to send to process list and move on
22:05 <@chrisc> fine my me
22:05 <@zcat> end
22:06 <@andi> oke so just rehashing vinces proposal:
22:06 <@andi> 1. we put the announcement feature online tonight on the uk site
22:06 <@andi> then amended with my pints of the no-trash
22:06 <@andi> 2. we use the following article types for the start:
22:06 <@andi>    Newswire
22:06 <@andi>    Hidden
22:06 <@andi>    UK Feature
22:06 <@andi>    Regional Feature
22:06 <@andi>    Startpage-special (sticky on top)
22:06 <@andi> 3. we keep the actions section as it is for the launch
22:06 <@andi> 4. we  keep world in region without wire
22:07 <@andi> 5. ?
22:07 <@andi> end
22:07  * zcat hand
22:07  * andi zcat
22:07  * andi : zcat go on
22:07 <@zcat> would sticky and world page box overlap
22:08 <@zcat> ?end
22:08  * andi raises hand and tlks
22:08 <@andi> yes but that's no prob coz when the thing is over you classify a world sticky bit as UKfeatures with world as a region
22:09 <@zcat> k
22:09 <@andi> if the sticky bit is about uk then we can classify it as uk feature when it's over and it will roll down the page
22:09 <@andi> end\
22:09  * nina doesn't understand what andi said
22:10  * andi is sorry
22:10  * andi will try again...
22:10 <@andi> ok - jordis idea was to use the sticky bit for world
22:10  * ana_ldn has a question
22:10 <@andi> ana?
22:11 <@andi> sorry don't want to confuse everybody again...
22:11 < Maqu1> andi go on explaining
22:11 <@andi> ana please ask...
22:11 < ana_ldn> ok
22:11 < ana_ldn> is this indispensable before we put the mir up?
22:12 < ana_ldn> i'd like to concentrate in thing that really need doing before
22:12 < ana_ldn> end
22:12 <@andi> well its indispensible to make clear what which articletype does i guess...
22:12 <@andi> ok i go on tlking about the article types:
22:12 < Maqu1> its also indispensable coz if i have a world feat 5 minutes after mir goes alive i wanna know where to put it
22:12 < Maqu1> sorry
22:13  * ana_ldn another question
22:13 <@andi> check what elements are there NOW on http://uktest.indymedia.de/en/
22:14 <@andi> "New Fox reality show to determine ruler of Iraq" is the "Startpage-special (sticky on top)" article type
22:14 <@andi> "World News" is the UK Feature article type
22:15 <@andi> "Sheffield Feature Long Title" is the UK Featurew article type with the sheffield box ticked
22:15 <@andi> if London do a "London BLA" it would be a UK Feature article type with london ticked
22:16 <@andi> and it would appear UNDER the "New Fox reality show to determine ruler of Iraq"
22:16 <@andi> and it would be ABOVE "Sheffield Feature Long Title"
22:16 <@andi> OK
22:16 <@andi> now
22:16 <@andi> if we want "New Fox reality show to determine ruler of Iraq" in the world page
22:17 <@andi> then the only thing we ned is to change the article type
22:17 <@andi> from "Startpage-special (sticky on top)"
22:17 <@andi> to "UK Feature" and tick the "world box - it the is still on the frontpage but rolls down
22:17 <@andi> OR
22:18 <@andi> we change the article typoe from "Startpage-special (sticky on top)" to REGIONAL feature
22:18 <@andi> then its ONLY on the world archive but NOT on the UK front
22:18 <@andi> end
22:18  * nina raises hand
22:18  * andi nina go on
22:18  * ana_ldn raises too
22:19  * andi nina first, then ana
22:19 < nina> ok got it now - but one maybe stupid question
22:19 < nina> can there be more than one sticky startpage special?
22:19  * andi doesn't think so...
22:20 < nina> that's all end
22:20  * chrisc yes it's a loop in the templates
22:20  * chrisc will try adding another...
22:20  * andi says aaah - cool... ana, then chris explaining?
22:21 < ana_ldn> just to say, that for the user's point of view
22:21 < ana_ldn> it would be nice to have 'world' as a region
22:21 < ana_ldn> for people who post news from, say, thesaloniki
22:21 < ana_ldn> i'm not sure how the newswire would work
22:21 < ana_ldn> but i would propose to have the world page 
22:22 < ana_ldn> both with a newswire with the world postings
22:22 < ana_ldn> and as an archive
22:22 < ana_ldn> but then the feautures list
22:22 < ana_ldn> would administer those world postings
22:22 < ana_ldn> just as it is doing now...
22:22  * andi had AGAIN a bloody call so needs to go away for 5 minutes - anyone facilitatin please?
22:23 < ana_ldn> at least i have proposed world features
22:23 < ana_ldn> to the features list in the past
22:23 -!- andi is now known as andi_bloodyjob
22:23  * ana_ldn can facilitate if no one else
22:23 < ana_ldn> but going on:
22:23 < ana_ldn> maqui would you be ok with this
22:23  * chrisc there are now two specials up... http://uktest.indymedia.de/en/
22:23 < ana_ldn> end
22:24  * Maqu1 hand
22:24  * chrisc not there are not...
22:25  * Maqu1 aaah coz coudnt see them :0
22:25 <@chrisc> go for it maqi
22:25 < ana_ldn> maqui then chris
22:25 < Maqu1> hmmmm ...
22:25 < Maqu1> ana are you proposing to have an archive of world news with a newswire only made of world news postings
22:25 < ana_ldn> yes
22:26 < Maqu1> that would be administered n the feat list no?
22:26 < ana_ldn> yes
22:26 < Maqu1> idea is kool
22:26 < Maqu1> i like it but again
22:26 < Maqu1> double workload
22:26 < Maqu1> not only having to do feats on the list
22:26 < Maqu1> but also postings
22:26 < Maqu1> not sure how sustainable is to put more admis tasks right now
22:26  * ana_ldn raises hand to answer maqui
22:27 < Maqu1> maybe when all collectives are used to new site it will be possible
22:27 < Maqu1> enc
22:27 < ana_ldn> chris wanted to explain sth?
22:28 < ana_ldn> chris?
22:28 < ana_ldn> ok: i don't see it as a double work load
22:28 <@chrisc> there is only special on the front page even after several have been added - i just tested it
22:28 < ana_ldn> (hadn
22:29 < ana_ldn> hadn't finished but can you explain please)
22:29 < ana_ldn> chris?
22:29 <@chrisc> sorry, it was a question that came up a while ago, not a big deal
22:29 <@chrisc> http://uktest.indymedia.de/en/
22:30  * ana_ldn no answer so i'll go on
22:30  * Maqu1 you mean no poss to have two special feat boxes no?
22:30  * chrisc no
22:30 -!- zcat is now known as zcatfood
22:30  * Maqu1 ok
22:30 < Maqu1> ana go on please
22:30 < ana_ldn> thanks
22:31 < ana_ldn> as i understood in the last training i had (sorry but it 'was' lancaster)
22:31 < ana_ldn> the administrators can also choose how to view the admin page
22:31 < ana_ldn> they can see only london postings if they want
22:31 < ana_ldn> or they can see all uk postings if they want
22:32 < ana_ldn> so one can look at all postings
22:32 < ana_ldn> and will see the world postings too
22:32 < ana_ldn> then propose a feature for the front page
22:32 < ana_ldn> as it's done now
22:32 < ana_ldn> and after some time pass this to the world archive
22:32 < ana_ldn> as it's done now (i said that) :)
22:33 < ana_ldn> what d'you think
22:33 < ana_ldn> end
22:33  * Maqu1 me?
22:33 < ana_ldn> yes
22:33 <@chrisc> i think that once the site is up and running that there are going to be lots on improvements that we will want to see in time...
22:33 < Maqu1> as i said as an idea i think is good
22:34 < Maqu1> but at the end of the day the administrator(s) will have to manually feed the world page newswire (select) with only world news postings
22:34 < Maqu1> and that's a task innit?
22:34 < Maqu1> end
22:34 < Maqu1> but anyway maybe that's not so important now
22:35 < Maqu1> noe end :)
22:35  * ionnek agrees
22:35  * ana_ldn raises
22:35  * ionnek too
22:35 < ana_ldn> but can we kind of agree to propose this in lists then?
22:35 < ana_ldn> ok ionnek
22:35 < Maqu1> k
22:35 <@ionnek> finish this first
22:35  * chrisc raises hand
22:35 <@ionnek> go on i'm off topic
22:36 < ana_ldn> chirs
22:36 <@chrisc> admin won't need to select world on newswire stuff
22:36 <@chrisc> because the posters can
22:36 <@chrisc> </end>
22:36 -!- gdm [~andrei at 62.30.160.143] has joined #uk
22:36 <@ionnek> cool, chirs!
22:37 < gdm> hello all!
22:37 <@chrisc> hi
22:37 <@ionnek> hi
22:37 < ana_ldn> hello - sorry now it's ionnek
22:37 < Maqu1> hi
22:37 <@ionnek> what I wanted to say - 
22:37 < Maqu1> gdm can u introduce yourself please
22:37 -!- fidra_away is now known as fidra_justinhavingtea
22:38 <@ionnek> in the beginning we asked which regional imcs are ready to go for mir. i.e. have a template and admins. We established that sehff ox lon are ready, cambridge and leeds seem to have templates as well. 
22:38 -!- mode/#uk [+o Maqu1] by ChanServ
22:39 -!- mode/#uk [+o ana_ldn] by ChanServ
22:39 <@ionnek> now there are people from lancester here, and (welcome back) scotland. 
22:39 -!- Maqu1 [shadowirc at 62.255.72.179] has left #uk []
22:39 <@ionnek> should we ask again - what the regional imcs want to do?
22:39 < gdm> will rejoin in a min and explain... womblemedic at bigfoot.com
22:40 <@ionnek> end
22:40 -!- gdm [~andrei at 62.30.160.143] has quit [Client Quit]
22:40  * chrisc agrees with ionnek
22:40 <@ana_ldn> chris
22:40 <@ionnek> ... so question to nina, mp, and fidra_whenyoufinishedyourtea - are you here?
22:41 -!- gdm [~gdm at 62.30.160.143] has joined #uk
22:41 < nina> yes nina here
22:41 < gdm> hello again (continue the discussion!)
22:42 <@ionnek> you know what's up whereever you're involved?
22:43 <@ionnek> hmmm - maybe invite them to jump into the converstaion when they're ready?
22:44 <@ionnek> oh sorry now food's done.
22:44 <@ana_ldn> i'm going to eat too, will come back though
22:44 <@ana_ldn> i was facilitating so now it's up to the remaining people
22:44 <@chrisc> ok
22:44 -!- ionnek is now known as ionnek_food
22:45 <@ana_ldn> i think chris or maqui should go back to the agenda
22:45 <@ana_ldn> and sum up what's been agreed and try to move on
22:45  * chrisc wonders where we got too...
22:45 <@ana_ldn> but at some point those who just joined
22:45 -!- andi_bloodyjob is now known as andi
22:45 <@ana_ldn> should 'update' us as on how much they see
22:46 <@andi>  kaahad
22:46 <@ana_ldn> their local groups prepared for the mir 'jump'
22:46 <@ana_ldn> that's it from me
22:46 <@ana_ldn> i'm having a nice dinner with nice people
22:46 -!- ana_ldn is now known as ana_dinner
22:46 -!- nina is now known as nina_pancakes
22:46  * andi reads what was said
22:47  * gdm raises hand
22:48 <@chrisc> go for it gdm
22:48 < gdm> thx
22:48 < gdm> just quickly wanted to introduce myself
22:48 < gdm> and apologise for missing the beginning of the meet (all of it!) - just got in from work
22:49 < gdm> i've been following the discussion on emerg. list
22:49 < gdm> and have quite a few thoughts on the discussion posted by Sara
22:49 < gdm> also liked the idea of 'other regions' and that way everything could/should be on front page AND on another page
22:50 < gdm> but this prob. isn't even relevant now so I will shut up about that
22:50 < gdm> also,
22:50 < gdm> v. impressed with the mir stuff - it's looking good!
22:50 < gdm> <end>
22:50  * andi raises hand
22:50 <@chrisc> um, andi
22:51 <@andi> gdm: there was some heated debate earlier about the other regions...
22:51 <@andi> not sure if there was consensus...
22:52 <@andi> but it looks like the "other-region-sceptics" are happy as long theres's ppple maintaing that section
22:52 <@andi> so i think the idea was to ask on network/process if there's people volunteering to maintain it...
22:52 -!- jmp [~jmp at 217.135.5.23] has joined #uk
22:52 <@andi> end
22:52  * gdm raises hand
22:53  * andi : go on gdm (assuming the facilitator role now that ana's gone)
22:53 < gdm> I didn't want to waste lots of time again about it - realise you have discussed LOTS earlier w/out me
22:53 < gdm> - but thought i would provide a quick explanation
22:54 < gdm> and introduction....
22:54 < gdm> i'm v new to IMC, but not so new to the "movement"
22:54 < gdm> and I will write some more in a letter over the w/e when i have time
22:54 < gdm> and i don't want to delay anything now
22:55 < gdm> so please don't let me distract you from the topics you were discussing
22:55 < gdm> or your summing up (a little bit!)
22:55  * andi thinks gdm doesn't delay things as far as he can sees it...
22:55 < gdm> and, BTW, my email is womblemedic at bigfoot.com - so I am not a comple anon. person
22:55 < gdm> complete
22:55 < gdm> <end>
22:56  * jmp raising a tiny little hand which is about colours/design - so no need to come in right now ;).
22:56  * andi : o yeah jmp?
22:56  * andi says there's no other hands now ;)
22:56 < jmp> just wondering about colour scheme - never saw any correspondance about it, so wondered
22:56  * gdm i've finished!
22:56 < jmp> how it all came to look like it does..
22:57 -!- mp [~jmp at 62.25.137.52] has quit [Read error: Connection timed out]
22:57 < jmp> i like the layout, but i think the colours don't liek me very much
22:57 < jmp> end
22:57 <@chrisc> jmp: accident rather than design i think!
22:57  * gdm respond?
22:57 <@andi> lol
22:57 < jmp> haha
22:57 < gdm> didn't some1 suggest a competition for the colours?!
22:58  * andi gdm go on
22:58 < gdm> in an emaiil on the emerg. list?
22:58 < gdm> end
22:58  * andi wonders if we need facilitation now that it looks like we're just 4 pple talkin?
22:59  * jmp little note
22:59 < jmp> with so may art backgrnd ppl in the network, we might be able to do better? ;)
22:59 <@andi> hehe
22:59 < jmp> just a thought...
22:59 <@andi> true...
22:59 <@chrisc> yep, we need someone to do a desigh
22:59 <@andi> let's skip facilitation no? we're just 4
22:59 < jmp> principally i dont like colours....
22:59 < jmp> ok!
23:00 < jmp> i am also moving to kitvchen in a minute (guetss arrived)
23:00 <@andi> all yummin away the rest...
23:00 < jmp> just wanted to note that i am into minimalism...
23:00  * gdm that's fine andi!
23:00 <@andi> jmp what colours wld u like?
23:00 <@andi> b/w?
23:00 < gdm> and which is which?
23:01 <@andi> waddya think of world in black'n'white?
23:01 <@andi> http://uktest.indymedia.de/en/region/world/
23:01 < gdm> [background/foreground]
23:02  * gdm views site
23:02 < jmp> yes, that is better in my eyes (but somehow i cannot very well access the site at all??)
23:02 <@chrisc> http://uktest.indymedia.de/en/region/sheffield/
23:03 <@andi> the test site is no good on internet exploder (if ur on a mac...)
23:03 < jmp> i really like this kind of layout: http://vancouver.indymedia.org/features/Technology/
23:04 < jmp> i am in mozilla/redhat
23:04 <@chrisc> :-)
23:04 <@andi> yep agree - nice and minimal!
23:04 <@chrisc> moz/yellowdog here
23:04 <@andi> moz/macOS = lost...
23:05 < gdm> moz/mandrake9.1
23:05 <@chrisc> yeah that page looks fine, we coupld copy that
23:05 <@andi> yeah that sounds good to me - copy for UK?
23:05  * chrisc thinks we should just design for moz ;-)
23:06  * gdm agrees
23:06 < jmp> i also like Sheffield's - sort of the same as Vancouver, just mroe yellow and sreaming..
23:06  * andi has no probs wif dat ;)
23:06 < jmp> it kind of gets in your fucking face - nice one
23:06 < gdm> though we should explain why!   (open source etc
23:06 < gdm> colours - i prefer black background
23:06 < jmp> we need a cool free software section!
23:07 < gdm> agreed
23:07 < gdm> lol - but that's a lot of work!
23:07 <@andi> thematic topic = free software
23:07  * chrisc i wisk moz supported sticky alternale style sheets...
23:08 <@andi> what i mean with thematic topic "free software" -  we cld easily have a section free software
23:09 <@andi> same category like http://uktest.indymedia.de/en/issue/antimilitarism/
23:09 < gdm> i don't like large amounts of white - such as nyc.indymedia.org or rochester.indymedia.org
23:09 <@andi> http://uktest.indymedia.de/en/issue/freesoftware/
23:09 <@chrisc> that would be good, 'GPL Society'  even... ;-)
23:09 < jmp> yea, thematic topic - i am doing free software stuff in my uni work, so i could at least quickly stick up some refernces etc..
23:09 <@andi> would have its own wire :)
23:10 < gdm> sounds good
23:10 < jmp> excellent!!!!!! BRILLIANT IDEA
23:10 < gdm> but does it need ppl to maintain at all?
23:10 <@andi> the middle bit needs maintenance yes
23:11 < gdm> (am a bit wary of being the 'newcomer' who makes lots of ideas then f^%$s off leaving the work)
23:11 <@andi> middle column is not done by the public but by admins
23:11 <@andi> gdm: right - spot on :)
23:11 <@andi> so u're not allowed to leave if we'll have an issuetopic freesoftware ;)
23:12 < gdm> lol!! - i'm always around, online....
23:12 < gdm> just haven't always quite figured out how to *really* make it all work together yet (for me, that is)
23:13 <@andi> ok - deal - u're committed now. no way out man.
23:13 <@chrisc> :-)
23:13 <@andi> it's logged :+)
23:13 < gdm> i'll help form a team, certainly.... i'm into the o-s idea
23:14 < gdm> send me the email w. the log!! :)
23:14 -!- Maqui [shadowirc at 62.255.72.20] has joined #uk
23:14 -!- Maqui is now known as maqui
23:14 <@andi> k log will go to process anyway
23:14 <@andi> hi makki nice food?
23:14 < maqui> yep and spliffff :)
23:15  * gdm when it starts up again - send it to emerg. too, please
23:15 <@andi> gdm: yep - chris you have the timed log i'm on a shitty macclient that can't do timelogs ;)
23:15 <@chrisc> yeah
23:16 <@andi> ok shld we try to round up what was said today?
23:16 < jmp> so what is the persepctive on white vs. black nckgrnd?
23:16 <@andi> jmp sorry
23:17  * jmp wondering: am i sorry or is andi sorry?
23:17  * gdm raises hand
23:17 <@andi> well jmp you proposed to use http://vancouver.indymedia.org/features/Technology/
23:17  * andi was sorry to have interrupted:)
23:17 < jmp> proposed is a bit much - just noted that i find it pleasing to MY eye
23:18 < jmp> like a ping
23:18 < jmp> you make pong...
23:18 < jmp> ;)
23:18  * andi sees we're back to facilitation then? ok go on gdm...
23:18 < gdm> I don't like huge amounts of white
23:18  * jmp me too..
23:18 < gdm> like nyc or rochester imc
23:19 < gdm> but some white with stuff in coloured boxes 
23:19 < gdm> (ie articles and columns)
23:19 < gdm> seems to work better on my comp
23:19 < gdm> and is less "glare" on my eyes
23:19 < gdm> hence, i think the uktest site works quite well
23:19  * andi got another one of these stupid journos on de fone and needs to help that one out
23:20  * jmp yea, that is a good compromise.. like sheffield, which i think is nice.
23:20 < gdm> end
23:20  * andi needs 5 minutes he thinks...
23:20 -!- andi is now known as andi_job
23:20  * nina_pancakes raises hand
23:20 -!- nina_pancakes is now known as nina
23:20 <@chrisc> go for it nina
23:21 < nina> but the vancouver thing has three colour themes - is that the whole point why it has been suggested?
23:21 < nina> otherwise it looks white to me
23:21 < nina> end
23:21  * gdm raises hand again
23:21 <@chrisc> go for it gdm
23:21 < gdm> i need to go to bed now (work early)
23:22 < nina> go for it? (anuone facilitating?)
23:22 < gdm> so just wanted to say good night
23:22 < gdm> and goo chatting w/ you all
23:22 <@chrisc> ok, cheers, good night@
23:22 < gdm> bye :)
23:22 < nina> bye
23:22 < gdm> i look forward to the logs!
23:22 < gdm> bye
23:22 -!- gdm [~gdm at 62.30.160.143] has quit []
23:23  * nina again
23:23 < nina> so is the vancouver site that has been suggested the white one?
23:23  * jmp raising hand
23:24 < jmp> i just said that i thougjht that it was nice, but i really think that Sheffield's is very cool - mayeb the yewllow could be slightly different... (4 ppl behind me agrreing)
23:24  * chrisc sheffield site still needs more work ...
23:24 < jmp> anyway - everyone... i am also off-ish (guests)
23:25 <@chrisc> ok, cya
23:25  * jmp the layout on sheffield site is fabulous i think - did you do it?
23:25 <@chrisc> yeah, some of it
23:25  * jmp the header graphics is excellent...
23:25 <@chrisc> ah, i didn't do that bit :-)
23:25 < jmp> and the way in whic the whole layoyt ties the page together
23:25 < jmp> i like!
23:26 <@chrisc> cheers :-)
23:27 -!- andi_job is now known as andi
23:27 <@andi> back... who's still here?
23:27 <@chrisc> me
23:28 <@andi> lol
23:28 <@andi> ok lets decide everything between us two then ;))))))))
23:28 < maqui> oopps sorry me but was looking somewhere else
23:28  * nina here too
23:29 < maqui> didnt understand the conversation bout colours
23:29 <@andi> hi nina maqui chris - what are we doing now?
23:29 <@andi> otherwise i'll have a fag
23:29 <@chrisc> dunno
23:29  * jmp also sort of here
23:30 <@chrisc> i lost track of what were doing a while ago ;-)
23:30 <@andi> lol
23:30 <@andi> btw lol means "laughing out loud"
23:30  * nina lost too
23:31 < maqui> aint got a clue what the conversations was for the las half hour
23:31  * jmp i confused evry1 by random babble about layout
23:31 < jmp> ;)
23:31 < maqui> fucking hell if someone watches this irc will thik were nutcases! :)
23:31  * jmp thought we were?
23:31 <@chrisc> he he
23:31 -!- fidra_justinhavingtea is now known as ab
23:31 < ab> am here, too!
23:31 < ab> hello
23:31 <@chrisc> ah, cool
23:31 < ab> but dunno what's going on
23:32 <@chrisc> there was a question from earlier for scotland...
23:32 < ab> yeah yeah yeah- I guess it's the are you ready thing?
23:33 <@chrisc> yeah i guess!
23:33 < ab> well, some slight problems with network keeeps us from accessing cvs stuff
23:33 < nina> i think it also had to do with whether ppl from the regional collectives are up for doing the 'other region' admin thing, or not??
23:33 <@andi> ey hi ab!
23:33 < ab> but for me, I'd like a rainbow colourscheme for scotland (cause its raining so much here)
23:34 < ab> and it would fit in nicely with the peace flag as the anti-war flag and colour during the last months, which coincides with the time when imc scotland was born...
23:35 < ab> :nina , well dunno 
23:35 < ab> actually I am a bit out of touch with this whole thing
23:36 < nina> yea i think there's also a question in the air about whether there'd be enough ppl to administer a 'other regions' page
23:36 < ab> one moment please
23:37 <@andi> nina: are you nina from manchester?
23:38 < maqui> hey - hey - where's the meeting at?
23:38  * nina is from lancaster, now based in edinburgh
23:39 <@andi> ah nina: oke thx:)
23:39 < nina> ;))
23:40 < ab> well am back now
23:40 <@andi> maybe now that there are two people from scotland here: how do you feel going live very soon with the openposting model "moderation afterwards" ?
23:40 <@andi> meaning not german?
23:40 < ab> I would not really want to administer other regions if possible
23:40  * nina is lost and embarrassed about it
23:41 < ab> as you now there are also other things in my life rather than hiding articles,
23:41 <@andi> yeah i gotta life too ;)
23:41  * maqui ab: r u saying scotland goes for the moderations before model = german one?
23:42 < ab> and with going life, I have actually no clue about the mir stuff other than the admin page but not understanding the cvs kind of stuff
23:42 < maqui> repeat: ab: what kind of open posting does scotlan favours=intends to implement?
23:42 < ab> and will leave for some travel next tuesday, so better ask sb, cause he will probably be the one and only to keep it up for the next 3 weeks
23:43 < ab> maqui: well, if we would have a reasonable choice based on wishes rather than practicability than sb, and me would be very much in favour of the German model
23:43  * nina wonders if someone can be bothered to explain the difference again between two posting models
23:44 <@andi> nina: in the german model only approved articles make it to the front wire
23:44 < nina> thanks
23:44 < ab> maqui:, andi: but will hopefully turn up at next imc London wednesday meeting next week, 
23:44 <@andi> in the others all posts go first to frontwire and then the weedin out starts
23:45 < maqui> ab: kool we intend to dedicate it to mir with some training
23:45 < ab> o that seems an entirely suitable agenda for me :-)
23:46  * ab is happy
23:46 <@andi> point of info: all people comin here today earlier said let's not go for the german model (reasoning in log)
23:46 < maqui> thats why i was askin ab
23:46 < maqui> coz my qustion was more to do with practicalities than wishes
23:47 <@zcatfood> gotta go its too late 4 me bin up long time ,will catch up with this tomorrow cu all
23:47 -!- zcatfood is now known as zcatzzzzz
23:47 < maqui> if most sections of the site go for dutch model (to give it a name) then what is the position of scotland
23:47 < maqui> seyya zcatzzzzz
23:47 < ab> maqui: ok, that's practically fine, let's get this thing up then :-), ideologically of course, me and sb would rather have the German model
23:48 < ab> and me particularly the German model with some voting
23:48 < maqui> mee to ... 100% ideologically ... and probably something to do about having spent 3 years cleaning that fucking newswire too :)
23:48 < ab> this wire drives me crazy sometimes
23:48 < ab> I appreciate the diversity of subjective opinions
23:49 < maqui> but point im trying to get at is:
23:49 < maqui> will sctoland go (together with the United Kollectives) to a mir project tha will implement the dutch model? if so
23:49 < maqui> does isctoland intend to do it soon(ish) = the same time as the resto of network?
23:49 < maqui> actually same question goes to bristol
23:49 < maqui> but noone is here
23:50 < maqui> so im hammering you ... sorry :-0
23:50  * andi says the question comes up coz the oxford lot wants to be online/live on next thursday!
23:51 < ab> as I have no clue about the technical stuff yet you are probably asking the wrong person, because at the moment I don't see myself able to do practical technical work on this mir subsection other than classifying articles and leaving messages on the internal notice board...
23:52 < ab> I got into twiki though! Just last week! My learning curve is slow!
23:52 < maqui> :)) laughing because mee toooo ... actually most of the network are the same
23:52 < maqui> but this can be solved with some training innit?
23:52 <@andi> well we could make the scottish site look like sheffield in rainbow colopurs ;)
23:53 < ab> I will try to get sb to pute to try to sort out this technical mess
23:53 <@andi> the london site is nowhere as well
23:53 < maqui> but can i put the question differently ab?
23:53 <@andi> we can easily hack sth in 2 days
23:54 < ab> maqui:go on then
23:54 < maqui> would scotland "politically" agree in joinig the new site with a dutch model?
23:56 < maqui> ?
23:56 < ab> ooooops- well *i* am not Scotland and *sb* is not and *harry* is not and *nina* is not... who knows what *scotland* would politically agree on? 
23:57 < maqui> well the people that happens to live in sctotland now and currently work on imc-scotland
23:58 < ab> actually we, as in me and sb would still try to participate in keeping up the scottish subsection running if it would fall under a Durch open publishing newsire policy, I guess.
23:58 < maqui> thanks
23:58 < ab> with slight preference to the Dada site though if it ever gets up
23:58 < maqui> kool
--- Day changed Fri May 16 2003
00:00 < maqui> reason why im hammering is because scotland's (as you lo :) and bristol positions have not been clear to the rest of network
00:00 < maqui> dont worry im not gonna askyou for bristols positions though :)
00:01 -!- ab is now known as sbunny
00:01 < maqui> so whats happening now
00:01 <@andi> hi sbunny!
00:02 < maqui> i think probably people is 2 tired to go on no?
00:02 < maqui> been here since 7
00:02 < sbunny> I just noticed bristol does not seem to have  any RSS feeds at mo
00:02 -!- zcatzzzzz_ [~chatzilla at 81.2.110.155] has joined #uk
00:02  * maqui dont understand RSS feed
00:02 < sbunny> ok I will catch up later
00:02 < sbunny> and look over log
00:02 < sbunny> and emails
00:03 <@andi> hi sbunny just to ask:
00:03 < maqui> ok whos here now and what are we doing?
00:03 <@andi> i'm here
00:03 <@chrisc> i'm still here, i don't know what we are doing ;-)
00:04 < nina> i'm still here, i don't know what we are doing and i'm getting sleepy
00:04 < maqui> shall we call it a day=night?
00:04 < nina> ;))
00:04 <@andi> no hang on -i think maqui was just having a conversation with anarchobabe about
00:04 < maqui> nina: r u lancaster mtg facilitator nina?
00:04 < nina> yup
00:05 <@andi> ... about the op model ...
00:05 < maqui> ahhhhh ... helloooooo ....
00:05 < nina> hi
00:05 < nina> :))
00:05 < sbunny> ab is away getting tea
00:05 < sbunny> I am ready to answer any questions
00:05 < maqui> andi go on please
00:05  * chrisc tea, hmmm, good idea
00:05 < sbunny> but I am sure stuff will become clear as time goes on
00:05 <@andi> sb: are happy to go live next weekend with mir even if it's in a dutch op model?
00:06 < sbunny> yes, I am happy to just let things flow forward
00:06 < sbunny> I can admin scotland section mir and train
00:06 < maqui> :)   hasta la victoria siempre! :)
00:06 <@andi> k!
00:06 < sbunny> I will work with cvs workflow as soon as my home netwrk back up
00:07 <@andi> sb: you know the london templates aren't dun either...
00:07 < sbunny> my puter is offline I am now on ads
00:07 < sbunny> abs
00:08 <@chrisc> we can kep this channel up for helping with stuff...
00:08 <@andi> sb: i think it's quite easy to just bring some tolerable design and colourscheme up
00:09 <@andi> and i have seen that the scottish section has regionalised A LOT of the existing uk-database - great:)
00:09 < maqui> so sb: can it go to the summary of this irc mtg to the imcuk process ans network lists that scotland agrees on going live soon with the moderate after model?
00:10 < sbunny> don't wait on us, but it will not be left for long after any launch if launched as is
00:10 <@andi> we'll have aface2face meetin in july... then we can trash out stuff and reevaluate
00:10 < sbunny> on regionalisation it would have been a lot quicker
00:11 < sbunny> if could selet all in search for blocking editing
00:11 < sbunny> but as one of I just spent the time
00:12 < sbunny> where does one report bugs etc on tech list or #mir
00:12 <@andi> best here on #uk and copy uktech
00:12 < sbunny> I have not been reporting as I guess if big spoted or if small not worth dealing with yet
00:12 <@andi> oh please report - its easier to keep track.../
00:13 <@andi> i did that last nite see
00:13 <@andi> http://lists.indymedia.org/mailman/public/imc-uk-tech/2003-May/000946.html
00:13 < sbunny> also I have been so rushed
00:14 < sbunny> also I saw chrisc brought up sub domains of indymedia.org.uk if these can not be done on poptel control panel or by them for us
00:15 < sbunny> then one has to be carefull moveing dns of .uk domains
00:15 < sbunny> see email later
00:15  * nina is going to bed: goodnight everyone! meeting tomorrow evening?
00:15 <@chrisc> good night
00:15 <@andi> nite nina!
00:15 <@chrisc> sbunny: we can create sub-domains and redirects ourselves?
00:15 < maqui> ciao nina
00:15 < maqui> ciao nina
00:16 < nina> ciao ciao lovely ppl
00:16 < sbunny> 80 quid a year fee from nicuk if goes to server not from one of there members
00:16 < maqui> mmmm
00:16 <@chrisc> what?
00:16 < sbunny> that is dns itself not just just pointing cname
00:16 <@chrisc> 5 quite a year for uk domains
00:16 < maqui> why
00:16 < sbunny> anyway see email
00:16 < sbunny> just wanted to let you know now
00:16 < maqui> mmm
00:16 <@chrisc> i can get them for a fiver each
00:16 -!- nina [~h at 62.31.97.118] has quit []
00:16 < maqui> mmm
00:16 < sbunny> no
00:16 < sbunny> there are ways round
00:16 < sbunny> don't worry
00:16 <@chrisc> but these are sub-domains anyway -- they are free
00:17 <@andi> hrm...
00:17 <@chrisc> i haven't got the email yet
00:17 < maqui> mmm
00:17 < sbunny> chrisc are you wanting to have this now
00:17 < sbunny> or wait
00:17 < sbunny> I can explain more
00:17 <@chrisc> go for it
00:17 < sbunny> or just put in email
00:17 < maqui> sorry ... shit couldnt see what i wass writing
00:17 -!- zcatzzzzz [~chatzilla at 81.2.110.155] has quit [Read error: Connection timed out]
00:17 <@chrisc> email to emg list is v. quick
00:18 < maqui> all this mmm means just "whay can i see my typing?"
00:18 <@andi> hrm point is it looks now like that global won't allow us to do subdomains of indymedia.org if not EVERY imc goes thru the new-imc process
00:18 < maqui> fuck sorry this this shadow gone maaad ... or its me?
00:18 <@andi> but we have indymedia.org.UK on poptel
00:19 <@andi> so it's a question of asking poptel nicely...
00:19 <@andi> to do apache httpconf..
00:19 <@andi> no?
00:19 < sbunny> or set cname or ip for sub domain in a control panel ?
00:20 <@andi> dunno waddya mean wif control panel?
00:20 < sbunny> if not move to Nic Tag holder who does http://www.nic.uk/TagHolders/TagChangeFaq/
00:20 <@chrisc> i'm a tag holder
00:20 < sbunny> great
00:20 < sbunny> not problem
00:20 < sbunny> then
00:20 <@chrisc> well we still have to have somewhere to host 
00:21 < sbunny> so you do not run dns servers, a pity
00:21 <@chrisc> sure we do
00:21 < sbunny> why can you not just handle the dns
00:22 <@vince_ox> hi!
00:22 <@vince_ox> can't believe the meeting is still going on...
00:22 <@chrisc> well there is also the apache redirects and what will the bandwidth usege be?
00:22 <@andi> hey vince!
00:22 <@chrisc> hi
00:22 <@andi> u know were MANIC here ;)
00:23 <@chrisc> we can see what poptel say first
00:24 < sbunny> ok
00:24 <@chrisc> if they want to change a load of money then we can think about alternatives
00:24 < sbunny> I am so used to useing domain name provider who are all auto
00:24 < sbunny> only control panel nobody to ask nicely
00:24 <@chrisc> but yeah transfering indymedia.org.uk to WEBARCHITECTS would allow us to de exactly what we want :-)
00:25  * maqui - ok im off - dunno what u are talking about - good night
00:25 <@chrisc> ok, good night maqui
00:25 < sbunny> I have a lot with justthename.co.uk but now only use top level domains with gandi.net with mutualaid.org often doing dns
00:25 <@andi> cya maqui
00:25 <@chrisc> yeah we use gandi too
00:26 < sbunny> but due to them not being uknic tag holder they can not do .uk domain dns
00:26 <@chrisc> nominet has a email based pgp system for admin which is neat
00:26 -!- maqui [shadowirc at 62.255.72.20] has left #uk []
00:26 <@chrisc> well we have our own nominet tag holder now :-)
00:26 <@andi> thats you innit?
00:27 < sbunny> well it seems it was all in hand
00:27 <@chrisc> yep
00:27 <@chrisc> but we should see if poptel can do it first
00:27 <@andi> agree.
00:27 <@andi> they have probably more bandwidth ;)
00:27 <@chrisc> yep
00:27 < sbunny> I think it is good to have that link with poptel
00:28 <@andi> i mean they were happily redirecting since 3 years...
00:28 < sbunny> also get them to do the www.
00:28 < sbunny> while at it
00:28 < sbunny> ooopps
00:28 <@chrisc> dunno about that...
00:28 < sbunny> I meant the non www.
00:28 < sbunny> just indymedia.org.uk
00:29 < sbunny> that often throws me
00:29 <@andi> yeah subdomains of indymedia.org is SLIGHTLY more complicated...
00:30 <@andi> i think they're not happy at all with the idea that the uk kollectives hand out their own subdomains...
00:30 <@andi> takes away centralised power...
00:30 < sbunny> I have yet to catch up on global stuff
00:30 <@andi> check the new-imxc list they say
00:30 <@chrisc> but we can do what we want with indymedia.org.uk :-)
00:30 <@andi> "EVERY imc has 2 go thru the new-imc process"
00:31 <@andi> chrisc: "we can do what we want with indymedia.org.uk :-)" EXACTLY :))))
00:32 < sbunny> lets just do indymedia.org.uk stuff for now
00:32 <@andi> i still think though we need some basics any collective that wants to join the uk kollectives should sign up to...
00:32 <@chrisc> yes
00:32 <@andi> but it's too late for me poor brain to think bout dat nw...
00:33 <@chrisc> we shgould do something like they do in italy
00:33 <@andi> yeah i like their 'conditions'
00:33 < sbunny> I feel once the united collectives has been build in a stronger real netowrk then can revisit realitionship to global
00:34 < sbunny> I had hoped to get some of my views on state of play of united collectives in an email but may be a while
00:35 < sbunny> anyway good nite I will just have alook over log and emails but still be here for a little bit if you have questions
00:35 < sbunny> but till next one bye
00:35 <@chrisc> ok, good night
00:35 <@andi> nitenite!
00:36 <@andi> anyhow just saw imc-westcountry have aksed for a list :)
00:36 <@andi> http://lists.indymedia.org/mailman/public/imc-uk-network/2003-May/000363.html
00:36 <@vince_ox> gnight btw, going to bed also... :-)
00:36 <@chrisc> yep
00:36 <@vince_ox> I'll read the logs tomorrow
00:36 <@chrisc> g'night vince
00:36 <@andi> nite vince!
00:36 <@andi> liverpool mailed me today and i mailed back but even the emergency list is slow now ;(
00:37 <@chrisc> no the emg list should be v. quick
00:37 <@chrisc> we can check the headers, it might be your isp
00:37 <@andi> hasn't arrived since hours...
00:37 <@chrisc> really?
00:37 <@chrisc> have you checked the web archive?
00:38 <@chrisc> http://www.email-lists.org/pipermail/imc-uk-emergency/2003-May/thread.html
00:39 <@andi> ah - just got "Your message to imc-liverpool awaits moderator approval"
00:40 <@andi> and it just arrived in network...
00:40 <@andi> http://lists.indymedia.org/mailman/public/imc-uk-network/2003-May/000364.html
00:40 <@andi> maybe i just forgot the emerg list then...
00:40 <@chrisc> http://www.email-lists.org/pipermail/imc-uk-emergency/2003-May/000127.html
00:40 <@chrisc> it arrived ages ago...
00:41 <@andi> silly me then :)
00:41 <@chrisc> i got it at: Thu, 15 May 2003 19:26:40 +0100 (BST)
00:41 <@andi> anyhow that will be mail no. 3 on the liverpool list ...
00:41 <@chrisc> right
00:41 <@andi> don't think they use email a lot - david mailed me privately...
00:42 <@andi> that's why i copied to netwrk
00:42 <@chrisc> ok (i wonder if i should join it and the manchester one...)
00:42 <@andi> i'm on the manc one but hear not much on mir...
00:43 <@andi> actually: hear NOTHING ata all
00:43 <@chrisc> hmmm
00:44 <@andi> but i think they're happy wif how things go as far as i can say...
00:44 <@andi> they just don't mail
00:45 <@andi> anyhow havin a fag now...
00:45 <@chrisc> ok
00:50 -!- zcatzzzzz_ is now known as ionnek
00:50 < ionnek> hi - how are you all?
00:50 <@chrisc> ok
00:50 < ionnek> hardcore!
00:51 <@chrisc> i dunno what if anything we have decided though!
00:51 < ionnek> question is maybe more: when do we decide that we have deicded :-)
00:52 <@chrisc> lol
00:54 < ionnek> maybe we have decided to go live with moderation afterwards, and evaluate in Sheffield?
00:54 <@chrisc> yeah
00:55 < ionnek> about "other regions": 
00:55 < ionnek> that email u fwded from southwest indy...
00:55 < ionnek> seems that sara who argues for other regions is involved in it?
00:56 <@andi> i think we came to a lotta clear thins actually!
00:56 <@chrisc> yeah, there was another email from her that i'm not sure if it has come through yet
00:57 < ionnek> ana and i talked about other regions again. and thought maybe go online without (correct, ana?) but at the same time try to get a few pp together who look after it, then put it up.
00:57 <@chrisc> i can fwd to you if you want
00:58 < ionnek> I'm not reading it now. am on zcats comp, don't know it well.
00:58 <@chrisc> well that sounds fine to start with...
00:58 <@chrisc> ok
00:58 <@andi> just dun a summup as i can remember might be wrong tho:
00:58 <@andi> 1. what regional collectives are we starting with:
00:58 <@andi>    oxford sheffield london are ready to maintain their section
00:58 <@andi>    leeds and cambridge are probably ready
00:58 <@andi>    scotland is lookin fine wif dutch so its a question of design
00:58 <@andi> 2. openposting model:
00:58 <@andi>    question: if most sections of the site go for dutch model
00:58 <@andi>    (to give it a name) then what is the position of scotland
00:58 <@andi>    ab: ok, that's practically fine, let's get this thing up
00:58 <@andi>    then :-), ideologically of course, me and sb would rather
00:58 <@andi>    have the German model
00:58 <@andi> 3. other regions:
00:58 <@andi>    heated debate, not sure if there was consensus...
00:58 <@andi>    but it looks to me the "other-region-sceptics" are happy as
00:58 <@andi>    long theres's ppple maintaing that section. so i think the
00:58 <@andi>    idea was to ask on network/process if there's people
00:58 <@andi>    volunteering to maintain it...
00:58 <@andi>    question is if sara wants to take on responsibility?
01:00 <@andi> 4. timing of launch:
01:00 <@andi>    vince wants to go live next thursday
01:00 <@andi>    others said saturday in 10 days if the publish bug is fixed
01:00 <@andi>    which looks possible (have to aks zapata)
01:00 <@andi> 5. we put the announcement feature online tonight on the uk site
01:00 <@andi> 6, we use the following article types for the start:
01:00 <@andi>    Newswire
01:00 <@andi>    Hidden
01:00 <@andi>    UK Feature
01:00 <@andi>    Regional Feature
01:00 <@andi>    Startpage-special (sticky on top)
01:00 <@andi> 7. we keep the actions section as it is for the launch
01:01 <@andi> 8. we keep the world section in the REGIONAL topics w/o wire
01:01 -!- mp [~jmp at 217.135.7.45] has joined #uk
01:02  * chrisc it sounds like we have had a very productive mtg :-)
01:02  * ionnek asks andi are you finished?
01:02 <@andi> that's the feeling i have :)
01:02 <@andi> i'm finished yes...
01:03 < ionnek> 5. really?
01:03 <@andi> empty..
01:03 <@andi> exhausted...happy :)
01:03 < ionnek> technically we can, my proposal has been up for 24 hours.
01:03 < ionnek> but not sure about colourcode competition parties and name of local imcs.
01:03 <@andi> 5.) maybe without clear date?
01:04 < ionnek> definitely  - thats what it is at the mo.
01:04 <@andi> ah - point 9 colourscheme... tb summarised?
01:04 < ionnek> oh have you discussed colourschem frontpage?
01:05 <@andi> yeah jmp and gdm came around talkin bout that
01:05 < ionnek> cause I suggested on feat a competition cause i thought we have to say sth about it not being ready... 
01:05 <@andi> that was when all broke down and everyone went eatin
01:06 < ionnek> did jmp and gdm say theyd work on it?
01:06 <@andi> don't think so...
01:06 -!- ana_dinner is now known as ana
01:06 <@andi> they gave an opinion only
01:06  * ana has just finished reading what she missed
01:06 < ionnek> so presently looks like we go live with cold chocolate.
01:07 <@chrisc> lol
01:07  * ana has a question/proposal about domains... but not if too late
01:08 <@chrisc> ana: go for it
01:08 <@ana> maybe you have seen my mail in europe list
01:08 < ionnek> ana raise your hand for f... sake!!
01:08 <@ana> (sorry just fighting with ionnek ere)
01:09 <@chrisc> which email?
01:09 <@ana> ok: well i havent' seen the responses
01:09 <@ana> but the idea was to 'push' for a regionalised new-imc process
01:09 <@ana> so that every one, all us, ideally all europe,
01:09 <@ana> pushes for the 'right' to approve our proximate imcs
01:10 <@ana> so we can have eg london.indymedia.org
01:10 -!- jmp [~jmp at 217.135.5.23] has quit [Read error: Connection timed out]
01:10 <@ana> without having to go through the crap hazzard global
01:10 <@ana> end
01:10  * ana asks for opinions and possibilities
01:10 <@chrisc> sounds like a plan :-)
01:11 < ionnek> there is a twiki.
01:11 <@chrisc> in the meantime we can do whatever we want with wherever.indymedia.org.uk domains...
01:11 <@ana> and having to pay for each domain?
01:11 <@chrisc> no
01:11 < ionnek> something like new imcuk or so. linked from global network / new imc / europe / uk.
01:11 <@ana> aaahhhh - that's fine then
01:13 < ionnek> about the launch...
01:13 < ionnek> how about linking the testsite also from the old publish site?
01:14  * ana agrees
01:14 -!- andi is now known as andi_job
01:14 <@andi_job> sorry
01:15 <@chrisc> i don't understand what you mean my linking
01:15 < ionnek> your linking?
01:16 < ionnek> dunno about that, but I mean:
01:16 <@chrisc> sorry by not my
01:16 < ionnek> if pp go to the old publish page, they can read a paragraph 
01:16 < ionnek> "by the way, we're changing the looks of the site, check it out here. 
01:16 < ionnek> ahm, not here I know you don't like that. 
01:17 < ionnek> and also if they go to contact.
01:17 <@chrisc> ah ok, why not...
01:18 < ionnek> hey chris, can you send the logs?
01:19 <@chrisc> yeah, ok, now?
01:19 <@chrisc> to which lists?
01:19 < ionnek> do you all think the meeting is finished?
01:19 < ionnek> lists: arrrgh thats another thing. 
01:19 < ionnek> emergency of course. 
01:19 <@chrisc> dunno? andi will be back i guess
01:20 < ionnek> but process or network? thats a bit messy. 
01:20 <@ana> process definetely
01:20 <@chrisc> i can send logs in morning if you want to continue after i crash out
01:20 <@ana> network would be for a brief summary if anything
01:20 < ionnek> i think I had enough with formal meeting. log now to process would be great.
01:20 <@chrisc> ok
01:20  * ana question
01:21 <@ana> when can we put a note up on hte site announcing hte future launch of the mir?
01:21 <@ana> and when can we put what ionnek has just proposed
01:22 < ionnek> I think we should propose a proper new mir feature on the feats 
                list. maybe an edit of what I send. then put it up 2 morrow. 
01:25 <@ana> i'll edit it now and propose it here - every one ok?
01:25 <@ana> (who's here by the way?)
01:25 <@chrisc> ok

-- 
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