[matilda] Re: Critique of capitalism..Proposal for workshop(s)

[fabian]

sorry guys,
it was marx who defined neat borders between the classes for rather
practical political porposes, e.g. to be able to fight for equal human
rights and that jazz from enlightenment...human beings were supposed to be
free...
but someone didn't allow this to materialize, the system, the ruling classes
he knew it was not like that simple in reality...(his works comprise
several 1000 of pages...)
but he was angry as well, as hell, because he saw people starving while
others dined.
we are angry
some are very angry,
others less
we want human beings to be free
fair enough
yet marx and all that was long before freud and freud just opened pandoras
box: when "we" say "we" want (us or others) to be free, only a very small
part of us is speaking (and a much larger part might be actually saying:
shut the fuck up, I want to be the boss! or simple: I want a hug...)
however...
we love politics and we are angry, so we need bad guys, bad things, bad
systems...its just same as it was for old marx...
but(!), repeating what he said is boring...
so what's new? Who's bad and what's the problem?
who has some answers for this?

F.

> So does all this make Matilda a proletarian or lumpenproletarian
> initiative, or a petty bourgeois ghetto? I'm so confused.
>
> Indeed, 0742, do you self-define within the proletariat or the
> lumpenproletariat... I assume not the bourgeois.
>
> Lovingly (with a hint of mischief),
>
> Chris ;-)
>
> worldwarfree at riseup.net wrote:
>> Dan O wrote..
>> 0742: Sadly, copying and pasting huge chunks of text from wikipedia
>> doesn't count as an argument - and it certainly doesn't mean that you've
>> demonstrated to anyone that you understand anything except CRTL+C /
>> CTRL+V.  But thanks for the link.
>>
>> 0742
>> Well wrong again i use the mouse for c/p..
>>
>> Now as said at the end if you desire a constructive debate on what i
>> posted then welcome if you desire to continue to be negative then i feel
>> you have nothing to offer myself or that of Matilda as you can not see
>> past your own intolerance towards me as a human that intolerance will no
>> doubt come to the suffice in other interactions you have with people..
>>
>> Dan O wrote
>> I've been thinking about doing some sessions on how we go about actually
>> changing the world.
>>
>> 0742
>> This comes about when we change our interactions with each other and as
>> said i had no pleasure in becoming negative with yourself however you
>> was
>> extracting the piss from myself and for this meson alone i had to make a
>> stand it was not in any circumstance an attack upon the very real and
>> continued good work of yourself..
>>
>> Dan O wrote..
>> A lot of current thinking about social change is based on the fact that
>> lefty thinkers (y'know, those useful bookish types who dreamed up class
>> in the first place) had to come up with new ideas for how revolution
>> could come about, now that the working class as a united force was no
>> more. (An arguable point...)
>>
>> 0742
>> The revolution will not happen it is a slow and sometimes painful
>> evolution of change and if we look at class in the structure of the
>> modern
>> world then agreed it has changed.
>>
>> If we look at class through demographics then it has not changed but
>> poverty and division if anything has increased not decreased just the
>> standard of livening for those in the first world be the uk has changed
>> so
>> has what people expect changed by default.
>>
>> Dan O wrote..
>> One answer: we don't need collectivism - all we need is a
>> self-organized, world-wide movement of 'one no n many yeses': the social
>> justice mirror of the decentralized economic system ayer average leftie
>> wants rid of.
>>
>> But does that mean that all us autonomistas are just leftie variants of
>> Thatcher's children? In rejecting collective action in favour of
>> 'swarming', have we capitulated?  Do we need to bring class and class
>> power back in?  Is this, in fact, class war?
>>
>> 0742
>> No we do not we need to understand the nature of class how class has
>> changed how we as humans interact with each other how we interact with
>> the
>> earth and look towards more better ways of change than continued blaime.
>>
>> I have no doubt the domesticated human will see its own Armageddon if we
>> do not look towards bater ways of working with each other and our earth
>> our mother..
>>
>> 0742
>>
>>
>>
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