[ssf] !7th Feb meet report

Mon Feb 21 17:21:04 GMT 2005

  I am not too bothered about going to scotland for the G8, i think it would 
be much more productive trying to stop the policies that they are trying to 
implement at a grass roots level.  To me traveling all over the world from 
one protest to another is very expensive, acheives little and seems abit 
like globe trotting to me.  I think that what might happen is, everyone will 
make a big effort to go up to scotland to see the leaders of the "free 
world" conspire against us and when all the leaders go back to their 
respective seats of government and try to implement all these "reforms" we 
will all be suffering from 'burn out' and have almost no energy to try and 
counter all the things that they plan to do e.g. ID cards, terror laws, 
'liberalisation' of services etc... etc...

  By all means do the sheffield G8 stuff because they are coming here but i 
think we should live within our means and concentrate on doing the stuff 
that gets support, makes friends and above all affects people on the ground. 
e.g. debt campaigning, lantern parade, peace in the park, spital hill  
etc...

  If others disagree then fair enough go ahead with your plans but i 
personally dont want to spend the next six months planning and badgering 
others to go to scotland for a weekend, i would much prefer doing somthing 
practicle that will get results, like stopping the demolition of spital hill 
or doing an anti-blunket campaign in time for the next general election.

for now
cuthbert

>From: Josh Davies <jimmy_bob_fish at yahoo.co.uk>
>To: Dan <dan at aktivix.org>, Chris Malins <chrismalins at gmail.com>
>CC: Ssf at lists.aktivix.org
>Subject: Re: [ssf] !7th Feb meet report
>Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2005 16:34:29 +0000 (GMT)
>
>nice one on the callout chris!
>
>i think we should put tht out ASAP
>
>as for all this talk of sinister left groups wanting to use the social 
>forum to mobilise (which is totally nlike the way that the italian social 
>forums mobilised for genoa isn't it?) well to be honest, so what?  i want 
>the biggest and best protest against the G8 that is possible this year, and 
>i think that the social forum encouraging people to go to it and acting as 
>a SPACE (that holy word which the horizontals use) for people to plan the 
>actions and to NETWORK (another of the porto allegre commandments) so that 
>they can be better organised would be a good thing.
>
>come june i don't want to be discussing the semaantics behind the word 
>'mobilise' i want to be taking part in action, who here disagrees with 
>that?
>
>josh
>
>
>Dan <dan at aktivix.org> wrote:
>Allo,
>
>Cool stuff! And we should be doing this, absolutely. Just a word of
>caution / something to watch over the coming weeks.
>
>SSF can be a natural focus for G8 stuff - but somewhere on the note
>sheets it said, "Use SSF to mobilise."
>
>Certain left groups (including the one that Josh is a member of) are
>very keen to use local social forums to 'mobilise'. This could mean
>merely shouting about global capitalism, and trying to cast the scales
>from the eyes of the blind, led and unwashed masses, enlightening them
>with our Damascan revelations about the coming revolution. (To
>paraphrase an old leftie I can't remember the name of.)
>
>If we're going to do this G8 thing - and we are, because it's coming to
>us, so there's no way to avoid it - we should work hard to do it in SSF
>stylee, not just in 'mobilising' stylee.
>
>The difference between these two visions is huge: they were played out
>during the ESF last year on a large stage. One result was the godawful
>SWP rally at the end, with Chris Nineham having his moment of addressing
>a crowd flooded with SWP-prepared anti-war placards.
>
>We need to do better than this - one one thing, as I mentioned, I'd like
>to do is to connect it to stuff going on locally. To show the links
>between changes to public services, for example, and some of the things
>that might happen if liberalisation of services carries on apace.
>
>(As well as 'mobilising' the creative resources in Sheffield to do
>something truly original...)
>
>But let's have a meeting and talk about it!
>
>Dan
>----
>
>Chris Malins wrote:
>
> > OK, having had what was a very good meeting last Thursday, I guess
> > that its important that we keep the momentum going on the G8 issue,
> > seeing as this seemed to generate the most enthusiasm. There was a
> > decision agreed by the G8 huddle that we could set up a G8 planning
> > meeting for the 2nd March, which is a Wednesday. Does someone want to
> > see about booking a room for that somewhere?
> >
> > Also, to get the ball rolling I'm going to throw out a suggested draft
> > for the call out to the G8 in June, pending anything Josh has worked
> > on. (Is he on this list / does anyone know his email?):
> >
> > "On 16th-17th June, 2005, the G8 justice ministers will meet in
> > Sheffield. They will be discussing how to prosecute Bush's 'War on
> > Terror'. They are the justice of indefinite detention without judicial
> > review, the type of justice that takes you abroad if the local laws
> > won't allow torture, that at Guantanamo Bay treats American citizens
> > one way and everyone else (including British citizens) in another.
> >
> > They are the people who think that inspiring a lively sense of terror
> > in their subjects makes ID cards ok, and that keeping out asylum
> > seekers who are not quite oppressed enough is more important than
> > social justice for their own people. And this will be the first round
> > of our protestation to the G8 that another, better world can, should
> > and will be possible if only they will let it.
> >
> > And so the people of Sheffield are calling on the movement for action
> > to be taken and alternatives to be presented to these people. We are
> > offering our support for any groups coming to Sheffield, suggesting
> > the Sheffield Peace in the Park festival on 11th June as the start of
> > a week of counter conference events, and offering the Sheffield
> > Social Forum as a coordinating space for action."
> >
> > Any thoughts welcome, don't worry about hurting my feelings, just know
> > that if you stand against me now my retribution will be swift and
> > merciless. Ahem, I think Dan's megalomania is rubbing off. Seriously,
> > please kick this around and start some discussion on what we want this
> > statement to say, lets have a view to releasing it by this time next
> > week.
> >
> > Chris
> >
> > Dan wrote:
> >
> >> Hia!
> >>
> >> Here's my initial thoughts, along with a link to the WIKI page where
> >> I've put the G8 notes -
> >>
> >> http://www.indymedia.org.uk/en/regions/sheffield/2005/02/305597.html
> >>
> >> http://wiki.sheffieldsocialforum.org.uk/SheffieldG7
> >>
> >> On the announcements list - we should pass a new one by this list,
> >> then get it sent out.
> >>
> >> Amp - wanna meet to get this done, or are you happy to draft one for
> >> the list, for the collective's approval?
> >>
> >> Good work, everyone! The top nutters are coming to Sheffield in
> >> June: the ones who use this kind of logic:
> >>
> >> "Sovereignty entails obligations. One is not to massacre your own
> >> people. Another is not to support terrorism in any way. If a
> >> government fails to meet these obligations, then it forfeits some of
> >> the normal advantages of sovereignty, including the right to be left
> >> alone inside your own territory. Other governments, including the US,
> >> gain the right to intervene. In the case of terrorism this can even
> >> lead to a right of preventive, or peremptory, self-defence."
> >>
> >> (And, of course, if we broaden our definition of terrorism, we get to
> >> impose our imperialism, which is defined thus - )
> >>
> >> "What is needed then is a new kind of imperialism, one acceptable to
> >> a world of human rights and cosmopolitan values. We can already
> >> discern its outline: an imperialism which, like all imperialism, aims
> >> to bring order and organisation but which rests today on the
> >> voluntary principle." )
> >>
> >> [New Labour's Robert Cooper - Tony Blair's 'policy guru' and senior
> >> diplomat.]
> >>
> >> (i.e. 'yes! yes! colonise us! We're poor and we're stupid and we need
> >> the first world to tell us what to do, coz you're so clever and brave
> >> and true and free!')
> >>
> >> I'm curious about that one: "Sovereignty entails obligations. One is
> >> not to massacre your own people."
> >>
> >> That's from Richard Haass - was Powell's director of policy in 2002.
> >> What about taking all the money from most of your poor people to
> >> subsidise the rich and pay for a war, and then get all those poor
> >> people to get drafted? Yeah, I'm sure that's fine.
> >>
> >> How - no, really, *how*, do these f*ckers get away with this? I
> >> concur once again with CM - "Bunch of sticking capitalist
> >> twattymuffins. Lets blow shit up."
> >>
> >> Ah ha! That should *surely* be enough for both of us to get put
> >> under house arrest, no? I'm sure it's more evidence than most others
> >> have attached to them!
> >>
> >> peace - no, really! - peace. Peace, but anger.
> >>
> >> Dan
> >> ----
> >>
> >> @mparo wrote:
> >>
> >>> Thanks to you, Alice, and particularly to the ones that did the 
>washing
> >>> up after the meeting and all the cooking.
> >>> Fan-tas-tically cool, yes. What were the opinions, if already known,
> >>> about "too structured or too chaotic"?
> >>>
> >>> R&A
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Alice Collins wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> Hi everyone, Loads of thanks to everyone who came; talked; listened;
> >>>> organised themselves; cooked food; ate it ; shifted tables; washed
> >>>> up; drank beer afterwards. I think the Big Open Meeting was
> >>>> exciting. Love alice.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dan" To:
> >>>> Sent: Friday, December 17, 2004 12:09 PM
> >>>> Subject: [Ssf] Ideas for 2005...
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>> So, yup, to follow on from the last e-mail, here's some ideas:
> >>>>>
> >>>>> * A social: music, spoken word, film, art, light and people setting
> >>>>> fire to sticks dipped in paraffin and spinning them round their
> >>>>> heads. Not been enough of this in recent times, for God's sake.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Issues: Indymedia want to raise money for the server appeal (can we
> >>>>> help?) Peace in the Park - what's happening there? Are they doing a
> >>>>> social fundraiser?
> >>>>>
> >>>>> *SSF2005: Yeah, maybe... but another thought - have a smaller
> >>>>> event during the G8 Sheffield stuff, but speak to Peace in the Park
> >>>>> people about possibly doing workshops / having a 'leftfield'
> >>>>> tent(s) at peace in the park, in place of in indoor event.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> * Organise a specific event on regeneration. I keep on going on
> >>>>> about this one and not doing anything about it... but it ties in to
> >>>>> so many things: G8, food sovereignty, local vs global, local
> >>>>> democratic control, giving the powers that be a chance to state
> >>>>> their case, giving us leftie rock-throwers a chance to find out if
> >>>>> they're human...
> >>>>>
> >>>>> * Hungry for Justice and the launch of the Green Food Map - there's
> >>>>> a post-conference plan for a Hungry for Justice website that'll
> >>>>> have the transcripts from the conference (some of the stuff is
> >>>>> FANTASTIC! I should stick the doc on the WIKI...) along with
> >>>>> resources on how to campaign, why it's such a political issue, how
> >>>>> it ties local to global, etc... SSF could help mediate all this
> >>>>> into a really good event, inviting Healthy Sheffield etc.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> * City Fair Trade status - a chance to get SSF, P&P, WDM, Christian
> >>>>> Aid etc together to talk about this one campaign.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> * Seeds for Change - offering them help to organise here. Has
> >>>>> someone else already done this?
> >>>>>
> >>>>> * A 'speak truth to power' workshop event: how to get what you want
> >>>>> from the powers that be: what their limitations and uses are.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> * Day trips! Let's go to Manchester, see Merci, go to the new
> >>>>> Dissent cafe / bookshop / space - which is ABSOLUTELY FANTASTIC!
> >>>>> They also have an 'urban art exhibition' - someone's gone around
> >>>>> and got photos of all the fantastic graffiti, most of it beautiful
> >>>>> and anti-corporate, and put it all on the wall. But you can also
> >>>>> tour around the place with a handy guide!
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Or to Hebden Bridge, or up to Leeds to meet the Leeds ARC folk, go
> >>>>> to Maelstrom, whatever...
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Er... that'll do for now.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Peace!
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Dan
> >>>>>
> >>>>> -- 07968 997861 0114 2412723
> >>>>>
> >>>>> The true meaning of life is to plant trees, under whose shade you
> >>>>> do not expect to sit.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> _______________________________________________ Ssf mailing list
> >>>>> Ssf at lists.aktivix.org http://lists.aktivix.org/mailman/listinfo/ssf
> >>>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> _______________________________________________ ssf mailing list
> >>>> ssf at lists.aktivix.org http://lists.aktivix.org/mailman/listinfo/ssf
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
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> >> http://lists.aktivix.org/mailman/listinfo/ssf
> >>
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>
>
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